Proposition 8

toasterhed

New member
Just wondering how other people out there feel about proposition 8. I'm sure most people know about proposition 8 and just in case, it is the proposition that California passed which made same sex marriage unlawful. Which had until recently been allowed for a short time.

As many of you also may know there is an increasing number of GBLT people and straight people whom support the right for same sex couples to marry. Many people believe that it is the same as saying a Mormon can't get married because of his/her religious choice or a black and white person can't be married etc.

In my opinion it is discriminatory against a minority. If we allow this who is to say that they won't start making laws about how the marriage must take place, under what religious belief, etc. We as people should have the right to choose whom we marry and how we'd like to do that.

I think it's a simple as that.

Thoughts?
 

Shadow

New member
I dunno. In Germany it is allowed. But besides the fact that I don't care who is married or not, I think marriage is a bond between man and woman. The original purpose for a marriage was to create a family. And that's why the government supported this type of relationship. In the end you could have expected a growth of population when married couples were supported by lower taxes etc.

Same sex couples of course can also have a family (by adopting or if one of them already has a child, or artificial). So from that point of view it's just the same as with hetero couples.

I'm more afraid, that couples aren't really interested in starting a family. They might only be interested in the benefits of being married... but that's just speculation.

The more you change a right, the less people believe in a government and it's interpretation of justice. Fast changing laws AGAINST people is more a sign of a dicatorship (is this word right? ^^). In my opinion the marriage of same sex couples doesn't hurt anyone... so why the change? Is California so poor that the extra payments (or lower taxes) can't be afforded?

just my 2 cents
 

Fla Flash

Staff (News -- Rom Hacking)
Passing Prop 8 was similar to jamming someone else's religious beliefs upon others. That sucks and that's not what this country is all about.
At least not as of this moment.
 

GeminiMan

New member
Proposition 8 passed largely because of the huge amount of money the LDS church and its members put into getting it passed. The argument rested solely on the notion of "preserving the institution of marriage" and support for the bill was gained by portraying it is being completely fair to gay couples.

I was extremely disappointed to see California regress with the passing of Proposition 8 after it appeared to have been leading the way for the nation in regard to gay rights.
 

The 9th Sage

New member
Passing Prop 8 was similar to jamming someone else's religious beliefs upon others. That sucks and that's not what this country is all about.
At least not as of this moment.

I agree. I think that anyone saying marriage has to be a bond between man and woman, or that a same-sex couple can't be a family is fooling themselves. For example, my sister has a girlfriend....my nieces are great kids, and well adjusted. There has been NO harm at all in the relationship that my sister and her girlfriend have. Actually I'd say they are way better off now than when she was with their father Bob (who deserves a swift kick in the pants).
 

Saent

New member
The belief that same-sex couples should not marry is absurd. What good could possibly come from this sort of discrimination?

Proposition 8 passed largely because of the huge amount of money the LDS church and its members put into getting it passed. The argument rested solely on the notion of "preserving the institution of marriage" and support for the bill was gained by portraying it is being completely fair to gay couples....etc.

I'm sure that the money they used to pass this piece of shit could have been used to, you know, feed hungry people or buy kids toys and clothes for Christmas, etc. Point is there's a lot better way to spend your money than on this shit.

If the bible thumpers are going to take every archaic piece of text written in the bible and exalt it, we might as well just bring back stoning.

It's also funny how a lot of churches condemn homosexuality and then they found out a bunch of priests were molesting little boys a few years back.

Just another case of "Do as I say, not as I do."
 

BIrvine

Senior Member
Ummm wow? A marriage should be between a man and woman.

I can't wait to hear about the first 'gay divorce' and the myriad of problems involved in it.
 

Fla Flash

Staff (News -- Rom Hacking)
Probably not any worse then the problems caused by 'straight divorce'.

And you get two cookies. Great point.

And as far as the "marriage should be between a man and a woman" deal, I'm not so sure that's an accurate or necessarily true statement. Who you love and why you love shouldn't be of anyone else's concern. Emotions aren't taxable (yet) or illegal. When that happens, I think I'll secede from the human race.
 

mushroom blue

New member
Ummm wow? A marriage should be between a man and woman.

I can't wait to hear about the first 'gay divorce' and the myriad of problems involved in it.

funny you should mention that. seems it happened. the only problem was that they needed a divorce that Canada would recognize (they got married there).

the world didn't end, or anything. two people got a divorce, and moved on with their lives.

more importantly, why is the state given legal power to marry two people? shouldn't marriage be a religious/spiritual agreement, rather than a legal contract? the hell with gay or straight marriage; it's none of the state's concern, IMO.
 

jdev

New member
funny you should mention that. seems it happened. the only problem was that they needed a divorce that Canada would recognize (they got married there).

the world didn't end, or anything. two people got a divorce, and moved on with their lives.

more importantly, why is the state given legal power to marry two people? shouldn't marriage be a religious/spiritual agreement, rather than a legal contract? the hell with gay or straight marriage; it's none of the state's concern, IMO.

The state has legal right to marry people because special privileges are given to married people. People decided that marriage was beneficial to our country, so the state sanctions marriage and gives it advantages over being single (I think it's a hold-over from British Common Law). That said, this idea about changing the definition of marriage is bunk. Marriage changes its definition every couple of generations. Last time it was interracial marriage, before that it was women being partners in marriage (rather than property), before that, it was marriage for love (which used to be considered idolatry, a more serious sin against God than gay marriage).
 

shawn

Active member
I agree. Prop 8 is just another bullshit law. They say we're the country of freedom, RIIIGGGHHHTTTT, tell me another big lie while infringing on anothers freedom. Good post BTW
 

toasterhed

New member
funny you should mention that. seems it happened. the only problem was that they needed a divorce that Canada would recognize (they got married there).

the world didn't end, or anything. two people got a divorce, and moved on with their lives.

more importantly, why is the state given legal power to marry two people? shouldn't marriage be a religious/spiritual agreement, rather than a legal contract? the hell with gay or straight marriage; it's none of the state's concern, IMO.

Exactly. I don't believe in legal marriage. Sure it has it's benefits, but I really am more interested in the spiritual aspect. Although I am not really in a hurry to get married. It's not something I could see just happening on a whim. That's for sure.

It kind of goes without saying that also it seems relationships in general aren't really treated as special/sacred as they used to. I just simply want to share my life with one person, whom doesn't sleep around and isn't an idiot. But lately my slight adventure into dating, at least the most recent anyhow... was a complete and utter mess. The guy had his head pretty far up his ass. So that being said, I don't see myself getting married anytime soon. Lol. It would really take someone special.

That's what I feel a lot of people forget about. They want the 2.5 kids, house, a husband/wife, etc. And in trying to become what they think they want they actually forget about who they are. I can't stand it.

I'll digress. Sorry if that's a bit less than concise.
 

The 9th Sage

New member
It kind of goes without saying that also it seems relationships in general aren't really treated as special/sacred as they used to.

I see why you'd say this, though it really depends on the individual. I myself hold relationships sacred. That said, I've dated a woman before who apparently didn't hold as high a regard as I did, so I guess I've seen it from both angles in a way.

(heh, never want to see HER again :p)
 

Reaper man

Member
I see why you'd say this, though it really depends on the individual. I myself hold relationships sacred. That said, I've dated a woman before who apparently didn't hold as high a regard as I did, so I guess I've seen it from both angles in a way.

(heh, never want to see HER again :p)

Interesting. My relationship is rather different. It's completely open, so while we love each other, we still enjoy seeing other people. We're just different that way, I guess. :3
 

The 9th Sage

New member
Interesting. My relationship is rather different. It's completely open, so while we love each other, we still enjoy seeing other people. We're just different that way, I guess. :3

Let me put it this way...it's one thing if you both have an open agreement about this, but another when she goes behind your back with a guy, and lying through her teeth about it even though it wasn't hard for me to find the truth once I found out (and sadly I learned that he's not the only one).

Needless to say, I'm more careful about who I date these days.
 

toasterhed

New member
Yea, those kinds of relationships aren't any less valid. I know people who have open relationships that are just as honest and loving. It really takes a mature couple though.
 
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