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devillion
12-01-2004, 03:02 AM
Do you think we will see DS flash carts and linkers? Some of my friends have been saying a DS flash cart is impossible, because nintendo blocked it...but of course, they don't know what the hell they are talking about, nor can the hypothesize as to how the Big N blocked them.

Are there any lockouts on the DS hardware that would prevent someone from making carts? Is there some technological drawback to the DS that makes flash cart linking impossible? Also, would some software be required to make ROMs display correctly on the 2 screens? Or would the DSHardware do that automatically.

Or is no one in the emu community interested in the DS? XD

Sorry i have so many questions, i am just really excited about the possibilty of writing games to my own carts. GBA was the first GB i bought a linker for, so i am excited to see what kinds of stuff will be done on the DS.

Maybe someone will write a PogoShell-esque application for the DS? With wifi capabilites? *faints at the thought.

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JCE3000GT
12-01-2004, 03:17 AM
I for one hopes this system never gets emulated and the games never get dumped. Emulation should be about reliving old classics not available anymore or arcade games you can't just go out and buy/play and not just a way out of paying for new games. I've started to buy games now instead of pirating them--maybe other people will do the same.


Note: this wasn't directed at you specifically. Just wanted to get that off my chest.

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icenine0
12-01-2004, 04:00 AM
Do the old GBA flashcarts work with the DS?

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packardmelan
12-01-2004, 04:09 AM
> Do the old GBA flashcarts work with the DS?

Short answer: yes.
Long answer: Yes, the carts all work, although one or two need their plastic shells removed. Also, since some of the 'internal' flashers needed the Link port on the GBA, those won't work. You want an 'external' USB flasher.

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Wren
12-01-2004, 06:50 AM
> Note: this wasn't directed at you specifically. Just wanted
> to get that off my chest.

But it's a good point to bring up. The DS has only been out for a couple of weeks and already people are looking for ways to pirate games?

WTF?!?

-Wren

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pipes
12-01-2004, 07:26 AM
> ways to pirate games?

Like there is anything worth pirating right now in the first place. This is awesome hardware that could be used for so much more. Just think... mmmmm... touch screen porn game<img src=smilies/liefde.gif>!

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AkaneJones
12-01-2004, 08:36 AM
>Just think... mmmmm... touch screen porn game!

I was looking at the screen shots of a certain japanese Medical Sim game for the DS I could not help but think of curtan sex scenes from certain bishoujo games and think this would be perfect for ports of them. But almost all ports of these games have been censored up for consoles and handheld. Just look at Pia Carrot 2.2 for GBC. Still if the companies pulled their perverbiale heads out of their asses for a change that could add extra boost in popularty to the system, and a few good games to boot. NEC seems to classicly been the only company to do so.


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metbot
12-01-2004, 03:45 PM
> Long answer: Yes, the carts all work, although one or two
> need their plastic shells removed. Also, since some of the
> 'internal' flashers needed the Link port on the GBA, those
> won't work. You want an 'external' USB flasher.
>
How would they work? DS carts are different size. (like an SD card and a compact flash card)

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Dark Macc
12-01-2004, 03:50 PM
> How would they work? DS carts are different size. (like an
> SD card and a compact flash card)

The DS has a slot for the GBA carts. [ T'was fun playing FFTA yesterday using my DS, actually. It looks so much nicer than it did on my 1st Gen GBA ]

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IceWolf20
12-01-2004, 04:00 PM
> But it's a good point to bring up. The DS has only been out
> for a couple of weeks and already people are looking for
> ways to pirate games?

I'd hope that at least initially....looking to emulate the DS is about being able to do it....not pirating games. I, for one, always thought that emulation of new systems was a good thing...pushing the limits of what people know, and pushing the envelope on what is "impossible".....like when the N64 was first emulated...that was big shit...b/c no one thougt it could happen....but lo and behold, UltraHLE was there. So, I hope that someone figures out how to emulate the DS, and gets demo ROM's to play....but it would be nice if a dump of the games could be prevented....but alas, im sure that'll be circumvented as well.

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The 9th Sage
12-01-2004, 04:49 PM
> Do you think we will see DS flash carts and linkers? Some of
> my friends have been saying a DS flash cart is impossible,
> because nintendo blocked it...but of course, they don't know
> what the hell they are talking about, nor can the
> hypothesize as to how the Big N blocked them.

It's not that it is impossible, but it's that no one has it totally figured out yet. I know for a fact that on the IRC chan #dsdev on EfNet people are trying to reverse engineer it. That's gonna take time. At any rate, what will probably happen quicker in my opinion is figuring out how to multi-boot files via the wireless multiplayer download function of the DS. http://forum.gbadev.org/viewtopic.php?t=4447&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0Case in Point</a>. A good amount of progress is being made as far as decoding the wireless signals of the DS and Nintendo's Wireless format (dubbed NiFi). It is mostly standard 802.11, but it has some specific changes, and then you need to figure out how the DS's do a handshake, how they let other DSs know they are there...etc. At any rate, I'd think this will be figured out before someone actually manufactures a flash cart.

I know there's a LOT of people wanting to do homebrew development on this thing, that's got me plenty excited. <img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif> Also, to comment on your flash cart, it has been theorized that if someone could load a bootloader into the DS via the wireless MB mode, then DS code could be loaded off of a GBA flash cart, since the GBA cartridge slot is so tied into the DS's hardware...it's common knowledge that the DS can access any data off of that GBA cart it wants, for example...the game Feel the Magic:XY/XX by Sega access the slot, and if you have certain Sega GBA games inserted it unlocks bonus content within Feel the Magic. :) Wether actual DS code can be loaded remains to be seen, but at the very least I'd think one could load wireless MB code from the GBA cart in a way similar to PogoShell loading a GBA MB code into RAM from the cart...that's assuming the DS does it in a similar way to the GBA though, although there's no reason to think it doesn't.

And personally, what I'd like is a NetStumblerDS, allowing me to use my DS to scout wireless points, and just see how many DSs are in my area, or maybe an IRC client using the touch keyboard, so IRC can be served off of my PC to my DS wirelessly and I can wander the house on IRC with my DS.

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The 9th Sage
12-01-2004, 04:51 PM
> The DS has a slot for the GBA carts. [ T'was fun playing
> FFTA yesterday using my DS, actually. It looks so much nicer
> than it did on my 1st Gen GBA ]

Yeah...the colors seem crsiper and the res better on the DS's screen. Also, another thing I was reading about...the DS's version of the GBA BIOS is basically the same except for one byte. This means that a GBA game could be written with the ability to detect wether it is being run on a DS or not. Not sure exactly what this might mean other than perhaps the gamma being adjusted on the game, but who knows?
<img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif>

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The 9th Sage
12-01-2004, 04:53 PM
> Note: this wasn't directed at you specifically. Just wanted
> to get that off my chest.

I'm not for pirating the system, mostly I can't wait to see if a DS Dev community such as the huge one the GBA has springs up once this is figured out...so many cool things have come from that GBA dev community. And with this new hardware, there are LOADS of possibilities as to what a dedicated Homebrew devver could create.

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devillion
12-01-2004, 10:37 PM
[in response to Wren and JCE's post, i can't quote you 'cause it is too many lines XD]

I know it wasn't sent at me personally, but that wasn't what i meant. Maybe by talking so much about flash carts i came off like that, but i really want it for the dev. I want to be able to write my own pogoshell type application, or other cool stuff. Right now i am drooling most for a Mozilla Style suite. Something like, browser, email, AIM/ICQ, and IRC.

Nintendo doesn't really seem willing to do that kind of stuff, but it is what i bought the DS for, really. I want that kind of usability out of this system, and come hell or high water ima gunna get it ;P. Even if i have to code it myself. XD

I think the DS will be great for user created apps. Think of the biggest thing holding other portables back from these types of functionality. It is the lack of a decent input device (ie keyboard). Who the fuck wants to use a d pad to enter text? XD Now with the DS, we have the touch-screen. Maybe some PlamGraffiti style recognizer will be instituted, but even just using the stylus and an on screen keyboard will be better than what we had with any other portables (mobile phone decks like the ngage and sidekick nonwithstanding ;P)

So, i'm sorry for seeming like a scriptkiddie looking for a way around his allowance, but thats not what i meant. I'm just excited by the chance to make stuff for this very promising system.:D

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JCE3000GT
12-01-2004, 11:20 PM
Cool...if that's what you want it for is development that's cool. Otherwise, people trying to get new games easily available for a system that's easily available should be shot. <img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif>

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Wren
12-02-2004, 12:18 AM
> much more. Just think... mmmmm... touch screen porn game!

But only if the games are packaged like this (http://www.gamegirladvance.com/archives/2002/10/26/sex_in_games_rezvibrator.html).

<img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif>

-Wren

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The 9th Sage
12-02-2004, 01:13 AM
> I was looking at the screen shots of a certain japanese
> Medical Sim game for the DS I could not help but think of
> curtan sex scenes from certain bishoujo games and think this
> would be perfect for ports of them.

<img src=smilies/laff.gif> I bet I saw the same screens you saw, because it occured to me when I saw those that one of the first things we'll probably see once people can code stuff for this thing is some kind of touch screen hentai game. :)

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packardmelan
12-02-2004, 03:09 AM
Or vice-versa. See, the idea is, you'll play, say, Pokemon DS (or whatever) and you'll be able to carry over your Pokemon GBA characters, and things of that nature. ...If a GBA game could be programmed to detect the difference in hardware, then it could possibly use the ARM9 processor to make 'helper' calls, and 'enhance' the experience when plugged into a DS....

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The 9th Sage
12-02-2004, 03:30 AM
> Or vice-versa. See, the idea is, you'll play, say, Pokemon
> DS (or whatever) and you'll be able to carry over your
> Pokemon GBA characters, and things of that nature.

Also, there is going to be accesories utilsing that slot as well, such as a rumble pak....er, some people with flash carts have accidentally gotten messages saying that instead of a GBA cart an "Option Pak" was inserted, and their alarm function asked about turning on the rumble function. :P Apparently has happened to several people, so it must not be a one person thing.

>...If a
> GBA game could be programmed to detect the difference in
> hardware, then it could possibly use the ARM9 processor to
> make 'helper' calls, and 'enhance' the experience when
> plugged into a DS....

Well, there is that one byte in the BIOS...I wasn't sure if 'enhanced' play in that way would be possible. Actually, PCEadvance does detect the DS, but I'm not sure if it does anything different as a result of that.


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packardmelan
12-02-2004, 03:38 AM
> Well, there is that one byte in the BIOS...I wasn't sure if
> 'enhanced' play in that way would be possible. Actually,
> PCEadvance does detect the DS, but I'm not sure if it does
> anything different as a result of that.

Unless it's specifically programmed for it, I doubt it. But, I mean, they were able to program GBA features in a GBC cart at one point, if I remember right. It wasn't a full GBA game, but it WAS a GBA level -- so I expect that to happen between the GBA and the DS too.

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pipes
12-02-2004, 06:38 AM
> But only if the games are packaged like this.

Damn! PS2 getting more then dude!

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The 9th Sage
12-03-2004, 02:56 AM
> Unless it's specifically programmed for it, I doubt it. But,
> I mean, they were able to program GBA features in a GBC cart
> at one point, if I remember right. It wasn't a full GBA
> game, but it WAS a GBA level -- so I expect that to happen
> between the GBA and the DS too.

Really? O_O What game was that? Btw, wasn't saying it would be impossible...I trully don't know, heh. And Flubba may just find a way to use the DS to some sort of advantage like that...PCEadvance could definitely use some of that extra power. Emulating the PCEngine on the GBA can not be easy. :)


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metbot
12-03-2004, 03:47 PM
no the flash readers. the cart woudlnt fit even if you dismantle them

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packardmelan
12-03-2004, 10:26 PM
> Really? O_O What game was that? Btw, wasn't saying it
> would be impossible...I trully don't know, heh. And Flubba
> may just find a way to use the DS to some sort of advantage
> like that...PCEadvance could definitely use some of that
> extra power. Emulating the PCEngine on the GBA can not be
> easy. :)

I think it started with a "S"... Shawntae? It was that little genie girl, I think. But, I mean, the Super Gameboy had similar functionality - and some SuperGB games had GBC 'features' too... so, I dunno. I would almost expect limited functionality as 'bonus' features to come out.

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The 9th Sage
12-06-2004, 01:01 AM
> I think it started with a "S"... Shawntae?

Oh, Shantae....always wanted to play that, heard it was quite good.

> It was that
> little genie girl, I think. But, I mean, the Super Gameboy
> had similar functionality - and some SuperGB games had GBC
> 'features' too... so, I dunno. I would almost expect limited
> functionality as 'bonus' features to come out.

Hell, the Space Invaders GB cart had an SNES version of Space Invaders on it, somehow. :) Full Screen and everything. Anyway, here's hoping some of the higher end GBA dev stuff can find a way to take advantage of it.


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