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Kitsune Sniper
04-29-2006, 06:28 AM
Man, what the hell am I doing here? I never come to this forum, but I feel that this is a topic I should talk about. First, off, allow me to quote an AP news item for context:

WASHINGTON (AFP) - A Spanish language version of the US national anthem released has sparked a debate with President George W. Bush bluntly saying "The Star-Spangled Banner" should be sung in English.

"I think the national anthem ought to be sung in English and I think people who want to be a citizen of this country ought to learn English and they ought to learn to sing the national anthem in English," Bush told reporters when questioned about the Spanish version of the anthem.

His remarks came after Latin American artists recorded "Nuestro Himno" (Our Anthem), a Spanish version of the national anthem, amid a mounting debate in Washington on immigration reform.

The artists who recorded the song include Wyclef Jean, Olga Tanon, Ivy Queen and Carlos Ponce.

Urban Box Office (UBO), the company that released the song, said it was urging radio stations across the country to air the tune simultaneously at 2300 GMT Friday.

"We chose to record The Star-Spangled Banner to show our solidarity with the undocumented immigrants and their quest for basic civil rights, as well as to say thank you for their contribution to our comfort and our dreams," UBO president Adam Kidron said in a news release.

"Nuestro Himno" was also released Friday to encourage people to take part on Monday in a national boycott and marches for immigration rights.

But the Spanish version of the anthem has sparked outrage with some calling it "The Illegal Alien Anthem".

"I'm really appalled ... We are not a bilingual nation," George Taplin, director of the Virginia chapter of the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps, was quoted as saying in the Washington Post.

"When people are talking about becoming a part of this country, they should assimilate to the norm that's already here," he said.

Even representatives of Spanish-speaking immigrant communities are puzzled by the song.

"It's not the right time for this," said Javier Magallan, the head of Tepeyac Association in New York, which groups some 40 community organizations that represent Hispanic immigrants. "I think it would better for us to first learn English so that we can understand the anthem and sing it in English."

Senate minority leader Harry Reid, a Democrat from Nevada, played down the controversy, urging people on both sides of the controversy to think positively.

"Let's not look at the negative," he said. "Let's not look at someone waving a Mexican flag.

"Let's look at what these people are trying to do, that is accomplish the American dream."

With that out of the way, let me say that as a half-American, half-Mexican person, and as a semi-professional English-Spanish translator, I find this Spanish anthem completely disgusting. What the flying FUCK where the idiots that came up with this abomination thinking?! The sole idea of ... PERVERTING such a national symbol, one that is very important to the country and its people, in such a way... what, are they trying to start a war or something?

Making a translation for foreign people to read, so they understand the song? That's fine. I've done that myself a few times. But rewriting it in such a way that the song's entire meaning is different?

Discuss.

(And if anyone can find the -real- lyrics to this mess, post them!)
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CEpeep
04-29-2006, 06:40 AM
Why don't Mexicans just sing their own national anthem? It seems rather stereotypical for them to steal someone else's.
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Kitsune Sniper
04-29-2006, 06:44 AM
> Why don't Mexicans just sing their own national anthem? It
> seems rather stereotypical for them to steal someone else's.

Mexicans didn't do this. Thank God they didn't do this. Please don't blame my fellow Mexicans... I assure you, we had nothing to do with this.
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CEpeep
04-29-2006, 06:47 AM
> Mexicans didn't do this. Thank God they didn't do this.
> Please don't blame my fellow Mexicans... I assure you, we
> had nothing to do with this.
>

I'm sorry. I read the article and it sounded like it was something Mexico encouraged and a few artists carried out.

I just read it again, and there's no true mention as to where the idea really came from, just the artists who recorded it. I hope others aren't led to the same conclusion I was, and I apologize for making such a statement.
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Kitsune Sniper
04-29-2006, 06:58 AM
> I'm sorry. I read the article and it sounded like it was
> something Mexico encouraged and a few artists carried out.

I hadn't even heard of such a thing until just a few minutes ago, when mom was watching the US local news. So don't feel bad about it.

There is ONE Mexican artist amongst the ones promoting the song. Unfortunately said artist spent like five years in prison for being involved in a child abuse ring led by a total lunatic.<img src=smilies/erm.gif>
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Lillymon
04-29-2006, 08:08 AM
Perhaps finally biting the bullet and actually picking an official language for your country would make me care about this in some way. As it is, English only has official status in the states, and (amazingly enough) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_in_the_United_StatesSpanish has equal staus in one</a>. On a federal level, Spanish is just as acceptable as English, hence I see nothing wrong with this at present.
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SwampGas
04-29-2006, 05:06 PM
If they want to translate it so that they can understand it, fine. But SINGING it in a public way to mock us is a disgrace. We're America. We're ENGLISH. You sing the damn anthem the way it was meant to be sung: IN ENGLISH. <img src=smilies/angryfire.gif>
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SpaceTiger
04-29-2006, 06:13 PM
> We're America. We're ENGLISH.

<img src=smilies/laff.gif>

God save the queen!
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Kitsune Sniper
04-29-2006, 07:26 PM
> If they want to translate it so that they can understand it,
> fine. But SINGING it in a public way to mock us is a
> disgrace. We're America. We're ENGLISH. You sing the damn
> anthem the way it was meant to be sung: IN ENGLISH.

I find the "We're English" bit amusing, sorry.

I don't think this is the first time this has been done, though - I think it was first attempted in the 80's or 90's... and well, it still sucked ass.
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SwampGas
04-29-2006, 08:08 PM
> God save the queen!

English language, I should point out.
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SwampGas
04-29-2006, 08:09 PM
> I find the "We're English" bit amusing, sorry.

Yeah that came out wrong. I should have said english language.
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pipes
04-30-2006, 11:05 AM
Eh, whatever. Sing it in Chinese. US doesn't have an official language.

<P ID="signature">The pipes clangor all the time!</P><P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by pipes clangor on 04/30/06 07:46 AM.</FONT></P>

Disch
04-30-2006, 03:53 PM
> Eh, whatever. Sing it in Chinese. US doesn't have an
> official language.


Agreed.

I don't see what the fuss is. I mean why should I care how someone else decides to sing a song?

I get the feeling some of you were offended by Jimi Hendrix' version of the Star Spangled Banner.
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Kitsune Sniper
04-30-2006, 11:17 PM
> Eh, whatever. Sing it in Chinese. US doesn't have an
> official language.

That isn't the problem. The problem is that some of the lyrics were changed or removed... and some things were also added for no reason at all. Just from listening to it for a little bit I noticed that there was enough of a change for the meaning to, well, be different.

The people responsible for this have the song streamed online via flash at their website.
http://www.ubo.com/
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Kitsune Sniper
05-01-2006, 02:12 AM
http://foxhack.livejournal.com/825720.html
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Kitsune Sniper
05-01-2006, 07:17 AM
> http://foxhack.livejournal.com/825720.html

Turns out around one half of the translation was taken from a translation commissioned by the US Bureau of Education in 1919, and the text is apparently uncredited!

I don't think this is common knowledge as of yet... the post has been updated with the information. Goddamn.
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SirDaShadow
05-02-2006, 02:03 PM
> There is ONE Mexican artist amongst the ones promoting the
> song. Unfortunately said artist spent like five years in
> prison for being involved in a child abuse ring led by a
> total lunatic.
Whoa...and THREE Puertoricans were involved.

WTF....

I'm a Puertorican...and I feel my stomach revolting by this obvious cash-in. Some of my in-laws were worried that this "Spanish Anthem" will take over the original. Folks, this is all about the money and the buzz it generates. Do not panic...it will go away...

What really pisses me off is that right now, in Puerto Rico, the f'ing gov'ment is paralized and public schools are shutdown due to a $700 million deficit....and they want to establish an explicit sales tax. Gov'ment spending has gotten out of hand, and instead of doing the right thing (ie LOWER their expenses) they want MORE money! The two main political parties are pro-statehood "PNP" and pro-status quo "PPD" (commonwhealth, see the wiki to understand this "concept"). The governor is from the PPD party and the senate is dominated by the PNP party. PNP wants a 4% tax, PPD wants a 7% tax and they won't come to an agreement.

Last time I heard they were going to work on a "happy medium" of 5.9%. But in the meantime, public servants are not getting paid and can not go back to work. This is all messed up and THREE PUERTORICANS DECIDE TO DO THE STUPID SPANISH ANTHEM instead of helping the people of Puerto Rico.

I really have lost hope from people. They are so utterly selfish...

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Danoz
05-03-2006, 09:20 PM
This really addresses an issue more important than this particular anthem. Right now citizens in the United States are divided on this, but what’s usual about the divide is that it isn’t necessarily a partisan one. In fact, the issue has more of geographical separation if anything. Right now there are thousands of people who support the immigrants in this country, but the psychology behind it is the belief that these people fleeing Mexico are doing so with an intense desire to embrace America. Do you know what’s going to corrupt that image and turn the populous massively anti-immigrant? Hanging Mexican flags over American flags, mass Anti-American protests and songs like this propelled by the media. If citizens start to feel threatened and invaded, the support that immigrants are enjoying now will quickly silence, and whatever administration running this country will have a constituent obligation to harsher punishments and border patrol. Also, be careful not to point the finger at “The Mexicans” or “immigrants” in general. These acts are the result of a passionate and angry select few, amplified by a sensational media and reflected back on the entire population negatively. As an observer, I can tell the continuation of this negative attention will not favor the interests of the working immigrant.
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Danoz
05-03-2006, 09:24 PM
> Eh, whatever. Sing it in Chinese. US doesn't have an
> official language.

That's just an idealistic statement with little or no merit. Whatever your ideology, the fact remains that a person can and will not thrive in the United States without English fluency. Promoting the US as multilingual nation can only work to the detriment of the immigrant population speaking English as a second language.
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Danoz
05-03-2006, 09:37 PM
Yeah, talk about another place with a lack of media attention. They fire 40,000 teachers (approx 100,000 staff members) and 500,000 students are no longer receiving education.

What do you think should happen here to fix this?
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Octocrook
05-04-2006, 03:29 AM
1. Many Mexicans get legal status the right way...why can't the illegals? Should we really honor them trying to steal what so many other Mexican immigrants had to earn?

2. What the fuck is keeping Mexicans from gathering together to BETTER THEIR OWN FUCKING COUNTRY?!

My mom, a very strict Republican that watches Fox News like 4 hours a day, was very pissed about the protests, however mild they may have been, and frankly, the more I think about the whole situation, the more pissed off I get. It's rather unfortunate because this whole problem became a problem thanks to the many companies that employ illegal immigrants to get cheap labor. Republicans keep wondering why Bush does nothing...DUH. It's the same reason why every time around this year there's the "we're going to investigate price gouging by oil companies" and it NEVER HAPPENS. They keep saying "we're going to do it" and if people hear it enough, they're satisfied as if it was actually done even though nothing was done!

The real problem here is that you would have thought a tragedy like 9/11 would have cut this bullshit out. Instead, it seems like Bush & Company would like to wait for, in the words of Charlton Heston in True Lies, "someone to park an automobile in front of the White House with a nuclear weapon in the trunk." Politicians wanting and getting big corporation money at the expense of our money and our security. Fun times.
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SirDaShadow
05-04-2006, 05:43 AM
> What do you think should happen here to fix this?
>
A new government and I'm not talking about any of the local parties. A federal intervention and impeachment of ALL involved in this mess. The US government has not said much about the situation, and I do worry about my family being over there. I would be more than happy to have them live with me in southern Ohio...the worse thing that can happen here is that one of my dogs might scratch my mom LOL.
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Danoz
05-04-2006, 06:11 AM
Fellow Ohioan? I'm at Kent State University-- hometown Canton.
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pipes
05-04-2006, 02:49 PM
People shouldn't get piss over some dumbass that did this, to piss people off, probly didn't know this.
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SirDaShadow
05-04-2006, 09:35 PM
> Fellow Ohioan? I'm at Kent State University-- hometown
> Canton.
>
Adopted Buckeye :P...yeah I know you were in Ohio in Wheelersburg-waaaaaaaaaaaaay down south, close to ashland, ky. Used to live in Columbus for 2 years, then in Portsmouth OH for 4 and finally moved to where I am...if only my family could realize how good and easy they can have their lifes up here...
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SpaceTiger
05-05-2006, 06:59 AM
Needless to say, the National Anthem should really be sung in Engrish. Pay attention to the model minorities!
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Danoz
05-08-2006, 12:24 AM
> Needless to say, the National Anthem should really be sung
> in Engrish. Pay attention to the model minorities!

http://theworldonaplate.blogs.com/the_world_on_a_plate/images/peter_griffin_1.jpg
Cause' remember... Guns don't kill people, dangerous minorities do. <img src=smilies/thumb.gif>
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