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JoeMonkey
02-10-2006, 07:15 AM
This is more of a question than a suggestion. What is happening with the site lately? Is the emulation scene this dead? or is there a lack of staff? I'm just asking this because Zophar's seems to be falling of the face off the earth.
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Lenophis
02-10-2006, 07:19 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

This is more of a question than a suggestion. What is happening with the site lately? Is the emulation scene this dead? or is there a lack of staff? I'm just asking this because Zophar's seems to be falling of the face of the earth.

<hr></blockquote>
If you're talking about the front page, I wouldn't expect that to be updated ever again. Right now, this board is all that is holding up the site. The site itself is just collecting dust, true to the name "archive" as Swamp gave it.

While there is staff and there is activity, it's been focused mainly on this board. Personally, I don't expect it to change, and I anticipate this site's ultimate death within the next 5 years because of the general apathy.

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JoeMonkey
02-10-2006, 09:50 AM
> In reply to:
>I anticipate this site's ultimate death
> within the next 5 years because of the general apathy.
>

Well I certainly do hope this site isn't going to die. Zophar's Domain has been my main source of emulation news for a long time. As a matter of fact, If not for this site I would have never even known about emulation.
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hcs
02-10-2006, 03:59 PM
> Zophar's Domain has been my main source of emulation news for a long time.

No wonder you think the emulation scene is dead...
While I don't share the gloomy predictions of some others, ZD simply isn't the place to come for *news*.
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packardmelan
02-10-2006, 04:18 PM
http://www.emulation64.com is where I go for *news* now. I've fought and argued to have ZD's front page updated, but it looks like that's just not the focus anymore.

According to SwampGas, ZD is now a "emulation archive"... and I can confirm that the newest emulators were the Nintendo DS-based emulators I uploaded, and that was a month or so ago. I never got around to updating all of the others, before I was caught and had my access revoked.
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Diskeater
02-10-2006, 04:27 PM
> According to SwampGas, ZD is now a "emulation archive"...
> and I can confirm that the newest emulators were the
> Nintendo DS-based emulators I uploaded, and that was a month
> or so ago. I never got around to updating all of the others,
> before I was caught and had my access revoked.

Woah, before you were 'caught' uploading emulators?

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packardmelan
02-10-2006, 06:10 PM
I don't want to get into all the nitty-gritty in public, but I think I'm safe saying this much: I'm not a ZD staffer. I don't have SFTP access to the site, and Sam's made it abundantly clear I will never again have access to the site in that way... despite being capable and willing of making updates to the site. ;)

I'm the one that got signatures 'working' again on tthe forums, re-fixed the rss feed (which is what killed the site that day - the rss feed linked to a broken script that I didn't write, and had to remove -- and is what pissed Sam off so badly), and built a NDS emulator page.

But if I'm not a staffer, and was doing all of this work on the site... that meant I was doing in an improper manner. And I was caught at it (because of the rss feed issue). My method of access was taken away from me -- and it was quite right to do it, because I wasn't going through proper channels. Of course, those 'proper channels' were cut off to me in the first place...

Hmm, this explanation was a lot longer than I wanted it to be. The big thing is, I was getting access to the site illegally, and I was caught and the access was taken away.
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Diskeater
02-10-2006, 09:48 PM
Thats the stupidest thing I've ever read.

Seriously dude, thank you so much for fixing what you could while you had access.
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king killa
02-10-2006, 10:07 PM
> Seriously dude, thank you so much for fixing what you could
> while you had access.
>

<img src=smilies/werd.gif>
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packardmelan
02-10-2006, 10:08 PM
It was taken away from me because I was doing it illegally - that much is clear, understandable, and I can't blame "them" for removing it and being angry with me for it.

I just wish my constant pushing, requests for access, and offers of help weren't rebuffed so completely. I've had Sam say it was okay, said I was on staff, and then ignored my request for SFTP access... only to publically call me a nutcase and tell me I'd never have access.

I was willing to do the work, capable of doing the work, and I could catch the site up in a lot of ways. Look at what I was able to do with the NDS page...

http://www.zophar.net/consoles/consoles.phtml
http://www.zophar.net/consoles/nds.phtml

Maybe it's not the prettiest, but it's easy to read, and it works.

I guess that's the biggest problem - No one is updating the site. Peep has told me privately about people 'working on things' - and when I'd confront them, they'd tell me they weren't working on the things Peep said... so that means *someone* is mistaken, or lying.

I've talked about updating the news page, and was told the staff wasn't looking for news updates - they're looking toward a site revamp. But where's the proof of that? Why is is so secretive? If we believe what we're told, this revamp has been, what, five years in the making? With nothing to show for it other than some pages I linked to a while back, and a crappy "newZD" theme for the forum.

This forum is so old and broken, that the idea of replacing it came up - and was smacked down like some ungreatful bitch because it would mean, you know, asking people to re-register. Imagine that...

For an "emulation archive", the archives are quickly falling out of date... and no one cares. Supposedly a PHP-based download/link manager is in the works. ...Where's that? Why aren't we testing that yet?

It's a lot of fluff. I've been on the SFTP and prodded around. The server side of things is a mess, and has been for years. The SERVER side of things needs a major revamp... and frankly, what's the purpose of archiving past emulators if we're STILL not able to select and download those files?

In short, ZD as we knew it is broken, sputtering, and dead. ZD isn't an emulation site anymore - it's an outdated, broken, sputtering set of forums where people who used to know what emulation was sit around and bitch, whine, and moan.

But nothing ever comes of it. I've said, and shown, that if I had access, I could get the site updated and spit-polished. I could bring in new people, and I could get the front page updating again. I could get a new forum in place, a new download system, rss feeds... maybe even interviews and articles again.

It takes leadership - something this site lacks. Sam holds onto the site with a death grip, but does nothing beyond host it. He doesn't care about emulation and never has. He doesn't care about the site, beyond being able to have his groupies, who he can whine to when it comes to DJing or trying to get a girlfriend.

We have moderators on a forum who bitch about having to lock topics once in a great while. ...What's the point in being a mod if you're not DOING anything? Simple - it's status. They have a little "A" or a "M" next to their name, and that means they're BETTER THAN THE REST OF US.

I've sat on #zophar before, and no one talks. If you start talking about the site here, on the forum, you're told to shut up, put in your place, harassed, possibly even banned for it. The staffers know the site is dead and like to put forward this great wall of disinformation to say things are being worked on in the background, where people whisper in shadows and meet in secret.

And the worst of it is, I've given up. I have the desire, means, ability, to lead this site back to its former glory - and to make ZD something more than a joke. ...And no one gives a damn. I've called people out and asked them to openly disclose new features, jpeg examples of the new site, something. And there's never any proof.

ZD is dead.
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soniczip
02-11-2006, 04:35 AM
> And the worst of it is, I've given up. I have the desire,
> means, ability, to lead this site back to its former glory -
> and to make ZD something more than a joke. ...And no one
> gives a damn. I've called people out and asked them to
> openly disclose new features, jpeg examples of the new site,
> something. And there's never any proof.
-----
> ZD is dead.
>

Well, I support your willingness and desire to make Zophar come back to it's former glory, because this place has sigs thanks to you, and I love sigs!<img src=smilies/thumb.gif>
You have done much for us here, and I appreciate it and everything you have tried to do. Continue to kick ass until the end!!!!
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SwampGas
02-11-2006, 05:17 AM
> I don't want to get into all the nitty-gritty in public, but
> I think I'm safe saying this much: I'm not a ZD staffer. I
> don't have SFTP access to the site, and Sam's made it
> abundantly clear I will never again have access to the site
> in that way... despite being capable and willing of making
> updates to the site. ;)

I never removed access to anyone.

But once again...you mouth off and the 5 people who come to zmd run up behind you with pitch forks and torches blaming me for something I wasn't a part of.

You are a jerk. Just like the rest of the whining crybabies who loooove to cause trouble and create drama. This is expressly the reason why I walked away so many years ago.

Life is amazing. I'm surrounded by great friends, I just bought two houses, and I was just brought higher up in the company. I can't begin to say how happy I am. Why?

Because I don't deal with you, some of the people here, and all of your bullshit kiddie negativity.

Now stop taking out your frustrations on me. When you present me with a COMPLETE, working system for zd...then I'll take the time to put it up. I'll say the same thing I've been saying for YEARS: someone just DO IT. You're using me as a scapegoat for the failures of everyone who has tried.
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Lenophis
02-11-2006, 05:39 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

Because I don't deal with you, some of the people here, and all of your bullshit kiddie negativity.

<hr></blockquote>
And yet, you still post here. <img src=smilies/upeyes.gif>

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

Now stop taking out your frustrations on me. When you present me with a COMPLETE, working system for zd...then I'll take the time to put it up. I'll say the same thing I've been saying for YEARS: someone just DO IT. You're using me as a scapegoat for the failures of everyone who has tried.

<hr></blockquote>
"You can do all the work you want. I have no problem with that, just remember it'll be my name on it in the end. So go ahead, knock yourselves out."

I'm not even going to try and argue with you anymore, Swamp. Your ego is gonna be the death of this place, and you don't seem to care. Well that's fine, I have what I need from this place as it is. Not like I can get anything anyway, this "archive" is greatly outdated. There's only been 30 new pieces of news on the main page going back to April 3 of 2005. 7 done by Gavin, who was effectively kicked off (and I'll take Gavin's word for it 10 out of 7 days a week), 8 done by hcs, and 10 by Fla Flash.

And what has been done with the site that isn't on the front page you got pissy about. So, here's to the death of a great site, and to the birth of a museum.

I seem to remember JadussD warning me because I was so forward and outspoken. Well, I am outspoken, always have been. If there is something clearly wrong with a situation, I will be speaking about it, that's for damn sure. If that warrants a ban, so be it. *salutes ZD*
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packardmelan
02-11-2006, 05:49 AM
> I never removed access to anyone.

I haven't named names because it's not my place to do so, but needless to say, I HAD access and was able to make changes - and that access is no longer granted to me.

> Now stop taking out your frustrations on me. When you
> present me with a COMPLETE, working system for zd...then
> I'll take the time to put it up. I'll say the same thing
> I've been saying for YEARS: someone just DO IT. You're
> using me as a scapegoat for the failures of everyone who has
> tried.

In other words, design a new site from scratch with no access to the server and hand it to you on a platter - and you'll take time off your busy schedule to take the credit for it.

I'm not taking any frustrations out on you, Sam. I'm posting on a public forum in regards to the site the forum is on. I'm not PMing you, not emailing you, not calling you. I said you were right to take away my access because it wasn't "through proper channels" - and you know full well that's exactly what you did.

I don't have express permission to put the full story out in the open, so I haven't. But that doesn't mean you get to pretend like you're completely innocent in this entire manner. You're two-faced, a liar, a flim-flam man. You're killing ZD. Let me try to explain why.

You own ZD. You've appointed "managers" and "admins" that don't have full access to anything - and up until recently, if the situation in fact changed at all, you were the only person able to make SFTP accounts to grant access to the server to even begin to upload things.

I remember when I was on staff, and even then you tried your hardest to make people afraid of you. You berate people for making simple mistakes - myself included. You never gave a pat on the back for a good job. You whined about how slow updates were... and made it known just how easily replaced anyone was.

I can only speak for myself on this, but you PMed me a while back and told me I was on staff again. You said I didn't have access to the staff forum because of a "bug" that you didn't have time to search out and fix. I asked about SFTP access, and you rebuffed me by not responding to the PMs - and when I caught you in #zophar on IRC, you told me to "dance" or some such nonsense. And when I complained about it on the forum, you called me crazy and said I was too "unstable" to give access to.

I don't even know why you host ZD, I really don't. Is it for the forum? You're never around anymore to begin with... which makes you a sort of absentee server admin. People on staff have been, and possibly still are, SCARED of you, and have said in the past that they had to -get your permission- on things.

But your grand, sweeping answer is, "Design everything from scratch, do it on your own server, do all of the work - which is impossible to do - and hand it over to me, gift-wrapped, and I'll look over it, and IF I like it, I'll use it."

How can I clean up the emulator files on the server without SFTP access? How can I write a new download script without access to the cleaned up directories? If I plopped years worth of emulators on a server, wrote up a php script and used a MySQL database on it to get the page fully designed, scripted, and filled out - what would I do with it? I couldn't just hand over a MySQL statement.

Beyond which, I seem to recall a few times in the years past, when page designs were brought up - and you called them ugly, and said they wouldn't be used on YOUR site. I recall it as recently as the Mambo install, which YOU told me about in lieu of SFTP access, and I switched over to a theme that was already in place -- and you said it was too ugly to use. Then again you didn't have permissions set up on the server to customize the CSS file at all, or to upload new graphics through the Mambo backend... and I didn't have SFTP access to make any changes.

You're oh-so-easy to get in touch with to begin with... if I had a little page and emailed it to you, and said "put this on the server, I want to see the output", I'm sure you'd get RIGHT on that. That leaves me to the 'suggestion' you gave me once, which was to ask a staffer WITH SFTP access to upload files for me.

I'll say this much: One staffer was kind enough to just give me his username and password, because he's busy with other things, and that's what I used to do the minor updates I made to ZD to begin with. And when I set about fixing the RSS feed, and it ran a script that -someone else- wrote, and somehow crashed the MySQL server, I woke up the next day to people stressed the hell out because you were on the rampage. The staffer that had given me access was scared he was going to be banned for his actions... but it ended fairly well, where he had to change his SFTP password and was warned that if he ever did it again, he WOULD be banned -- and that effectively, say it with me, REMOVED MY ACCESS.

So I'm a Jerk -- because I can call you on your bullshit. That's fine. You walked away? Then why the fuck are you still in charge of everything? Why do people still deferr to you? You should be the "silent partner" - the guy who runs the server and makes sure everything is in working order.

You point out that everyone else has failed. Fine - I've proved myself capable of making change. Why the hell are you so against giving access to people who still want to try? Oh, I'm sorry, I don't have a COMPLETE, working system designed to just hand over. Like you said, you'd "take the time to put it up." Meaning, even if I HAD a complete replacement for ZD, zipped it up, and emailed it to you, I STILL wouldn't have access to the server - it would STILL have to go through someone else.

I stand by my statement. ZD is dead, and you're the cause.
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SwampGas
02-11-2006, 06:05 AM
> I'm not even going to try and argue with you anymore, Swamp.
> Your ego is gonna be the death of this place, and you don't
> seem to care. Well that's fine, I have what I need from this

WHAT EGO? I keep repeating the same thing over and over: you want zd to succeed so much, but everytime I say "show me the goods" all I get are bullshit stories about ego and more lame ass excuses that involve ME.

Just go do it or shut up about it. Yeesh <img src=smilies/upeyes.gif>
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SwampGas
02-11-2006, 06:19 AM
> I stand by my statement. ZD is dead, and you're the cause.

So I'll pull the plug. Is that what your goal is? Because it seems like everyone is taunting me to do it. You and everyone else.

Of course even though I'm giving people what they want by constantly asking me to "just let it die" or since "zd is dead" it wouldn't matter....I'd still be the bad guy if zd were to just not be there tomorrow morning.

Bis interimitur qui suis armis perit.
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Disch
02-11-2006, 06:24 AM
> So I'll pull the plug. Is that what your goal is?

Call it a hunch -- but I think his goal is (or at least was) to gain SFTP access and other needed permissions to work on the site.

But he only mentioned that 6 times -- so that couldn't be it. /wwwthreads/images/icons/tongue.gif
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packardmelan
02-11-2006, 06:27 AM
> Call it a hunch -- but I think his goal is (or at least
> was) to gain SFTP access and other needed permissions to
> work on the site.

<img src=smilies/thumb.gif> Good hunch. It's easy to bitch about no one fixing the site when no one is getting access to work on it. I guess I ought to devote weeks of work to putting together a new emulation site on my own server, and then just hand it all over to Sam.
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Disch
02-11-2006, 06:34 AM
I don't see why it'd be an issue either. I mean you've already had back-door permissions and proven you wouldn't exploit them to damage the site. And it's not like it would conflict with any other work going on (since there doesn't appear to be any).
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packardmelan
02-11-2006, 06:38 AM
Shh! I'm an unstable jerk. Beware - I may break in and update the site for you! What a devious, underhanded thing for anyone to do.

Obviously I'm calling for Sam to take the remains of ZD offline, rather than to, say, let me fix everything.
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Fla Flash
02-11-2006, 07:25 PM
Packard, ya don't get it.
You wanna redesign the site and fix all the horrible broken links?....then show him a sample of a finished product. I'm about as tired as Swamp is of the whining. If my job weren't keeping me so busy and my eyes weren't giving me so much trouble maybe I could do something.
But I can't.
Such is life.
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JadussD
02-11-2006, 07:38 PM
> I seem to remember JadussD warning me because I was so
> forward and outspoken. Well, I am outspoken, always have
> been. If there is something clearly wrong with a situation,
> I will be speaking about it, that's for damn sure. If that
> warrants a ban, so be it. *salutes ZD*

What the HELL are you talking about?

I warned you once because you flamed the shit out of someone for basically no provocation but that's about it.
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packardmelan
02-11-2006, 07:57 PM
He's not asking for a sample of a 'finished product'. He's asking for a complete, finished, archive of work. Beyond which, I'm talking about - god forbid - updating the current site. So if you want an example of what that could consist of, look at the NDS emulators page I linked to earlier in the thread. That's something I did of my own provocation, and uploaded when I had (stolen) access to do it.

What sample am I going to show, when it comes to, say, an updated NES Emulators for Windows page that the NDS page doesn't show? A redesign is in order, yes. It's long overdue, in fact... but no one is maintaining the current site, either... and that's just inexcusable.

So tell me, Flash, how do I show what an up-to-date ZD would look like beyond doing the work on my own server, for myself? If I were to go through the list of NES emulators alone, to clean it up, that would be a number of hours of work -- to turn it over to whoever, and have it shot down.

If you're talking about tweaking the NDS page and making it prettier, fine, I can do that - if there's some microm of guarantee that something will come of it. I have shown interest, desire, and ability to make change happen to a dead website, and people complain because I'm "whining." Does that make ANY sense?

"I would do something, but I can't." Well I CAN do something, and I'm being told I'm not allowed to do it. How do I clean up the archives of NES emulators, to continue my example, on the server side of things if I don't have SFTP access available to me? How do I update the news page to say something's being worked on?

I tell you what, all of you who care so much about the site - but can't, or won't, show anything for it, get together on MSN, IRC, whatever, and come up with a plan of action for me. Seriously - instead of having me complain to a brick wall, and instead of sitting there and doing nothing, settle on ONE thing you want me to improve.

Say it's the front news page. Fine, I'll put together something on my server to show what it could look like as per what *I* think is appropriate. And instead of giving me a "No, not good enough" when all is said and done, tell me what to refine, and I'll make those changes until people are happy. Work WITH me and not against me, and maybe ZD won't be a dead site people remember - but an active site people enjoy.
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SwampGas
02-11-2006, 08:59 PM
You run around screaming "zd is dead" and are constantly taking pot shots at the site. You are not giving me a good impression of yourself.

What you, and countless others before you, have failed to grasp is that you only serve to piss me off and make me not like you. For some reason you feel that's the appropriate way to motivate me to trust you and to assist you. It's not.

Over the past 10 years, I've seen all talk. All of it. I had enough of the talk. Show me the site or shut up. The beautiful thing about PHP and MySQL is that it works the same on ANY system...which means you don't require access to mine to do a site. You don't need paths, you don't need files, you don't need anything. These are just more excuses.

Am I asking you to do all this work and then "just hand it over"? Yes. That's how it works. I've seen nothing but awful designs, half-assed spec systems, and so many promises/ideas that it makes me want to puke. Are you really that young and naive? Just do the fucking site instead of bitching about it.

Of course, right now it appears you (and everyone else) are more concerned about winning an argument and whining than getting any work done.
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packardmelan
02-11-2006, 09:17 PM
> Just do the fucking site instead of bitching about it.

If I "just do the fucking site", as you so laughingly suggest, what exactly would be my driving motivation? If I put that much work into doing a new emulation site on my own server with my own code and my own files, why, exactly, would I just hand it over to you and kiss my work goodbye?

Whatever, man. I've put my best foot forward, and I've put my worst forward too. I've gone from begging to demanding, and nothing comes of it. I've been the nice guy, and I've been the asshole.

I guess there's the problem - I've tried everything short of designing a new site from scratch, investing that time into everything... and then handing it over to you for you to either 1) take take credit for it, or 2) slap it aside.

Listen to yourself. "Awful designs"... even now, you'll openly complain about _attempts_ people have made in the past. When have you ever said, say, "Okay, I don't like that color scheme... instead of a bright blue banner, why not try something darker?" You don't. You say "I hate it, throw it out and stop fucking around. Show me a finished product."

I don't know what to do here, Sam. I don't know what to do. You're asking me to design a new ZD from scratch with -nothing- to go off of, beyond the current site and my own desires -- which other people have done in the past, to have you puke over. You don't work with people, where this site is concerned. You descend from upon high, raise your mighty fist, and bitch at the people who would actually attempt to make a future for this site.

I'm not trying to win an argument - I'm trying to get someone, SOMEONE, to admit that yes, ZD as it was is dead and gone. I'm trying to get someone to admit that NO REAL WORK is being done on the site as it is. I'm trying to get someone to put together a list of features or desires for the site. I'm trying to get this broken ass forum replaced.

If I had the money to put together a new emulation archive for myself, I'd do it in a heartbeat - but I don't have that sort of cash. Nor do I really have the desire to start sucha project. I want to fix THIS site, not create a new one. I already said before, I use Emulation64 for my emu updates. Other forum goers here admit all they come to ZD for is the forums anymore... so hell, why not strip ZD down, shove a htaccess redirect so the domain loads up only the forums, and call it a day?

You don't even admit defeat. You cling to the skeleton of a broken site and forbid people from making updates to it, at all. And you expect me to shut up on it? I've SHOWN these people updates to the site, and I had to go AROUND you to do that. People have THANKED me for what LITTLE work I've done... imagine how great it would be if the goddamned SITE worked again! If it were updated, and spitpolished.

And your answer, as it always has been, is "Do the work for me. Do it all, knowing I'll probably find something wrong with it, and instead of working with you to fix it, I'll tell you to shove it up your ass."

In short, you haven't motivated me to trust you, or to assist you. My interest isn't in bettering YOU, Sam. It's in bettering ZD. The site. The community. And my hands are tied, because I have no -realistic- way of doing that.
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

Disch
02-11-2006, 09:41 PM
This is getting overly complicated, and needlessly cluttered with side-arguments and past grudges.

Let's look at the facts, and the problem that is before us.

Odds are pretty good no one is going to design an entire site just to hand it over to someone else for funsies (I know you seem to think "that's how it works" -- but it's time to fess up -- it obviously hasn't been working that way). And my gut tells me you wouldn't be willing to pay for a site design. So demanding a 'full design or nothing' is essentially ensuring you'll get nothing. If this doesn't appear as forseeable logic -- I think the status of the past few years of ZD serve as proof.

That leaves us with 2 choices:

A) 'Stick to your guns' and demand a full design or nothing. ZD remains idle, outdated and stale.

B) Give Packard access to the site so he can touch it up and update it. While it isn't as nice of a solution as a full site redesign... it's still at least some form of progress. In addition to that -- it in no way damages any hope for a new design -- as a new design could still just as easily come along.

So that's it. Choice A leaves us idle as we are. Choice B aids the site at seemingly no cost. I mean really -- if there's a downside to option B that I'm not seeing. Please let me know. Because I really don't see it. I mean is it hard to give him access to the site or something?


We have someone here who is ready willing and able to put some work into the site and possibly breathe a little bit of life back to it -- but you're shutting it out with "No -- my way or the highway". I mean you're not even giving any reason -- you're just refusing.



You talk about all these people complaining and whining -- and I have to say that over the years I've found a lot of that whining to be coming from you. "People always blame me for things I don't do", "People are pissed that the site is outdated but it's not my fault/problem", "Nobody's willing to do the work needed to fix the site". I mean really... if the site is as big of a burden on you as you make it out to be... you'd think you'd want to hand it over to someone willing to dig in and fix things up. You've made it abundantly clear you have no intention of doing so yourself -- by reasons either relating to lack of interest or lack of time. Both understandable and acceptable reasons.

But you've got the power, and you're just sitting on it. Someone else has come along willing to take advantage of it -- willing to put it to use. If you're not going to use it -- hand it over to someone that will. Packard will use it. I know he's not your favorite person in the world. Hell you might even hate his guts. But it'd be good for ZD.

Perhaps it's finally time to pass the torch?
<P ID="signature"></P>

packardmelan
02-11-2006, 10:06 PM
I'm posting part of an AIM conversation I had with someone. I've edited it to remove who it was I was talking to, and I'm changing the format to make more sense.

Friend: "The thing you should ask yourself, and that I'm asking myself now, is: 'Does the world need a better Zophar's Domain?' Would your efforts be better spent on a site run by someone who cares?"

Me: "That, my friend, is exactly what I wonder. ZD was the first community I really ever joined and I hate to see it languish. But maybe it's the only thing that can happen. Maybe it really is dead. And my fighting, and arguing, would lead to little more than a band-aid to patch a cancer."

I'm not arguing in this post. I have a lot to think about on this... obviously, I'm not going to get the access I want until I have some sort of 'peace offering' - a download system, or something. And I'm scared to invest that time into it when its use isn't guaranteed when all is said and done.

And worst yet, to hand it over to someone that gives no sign of actually caring about the outcome.

I seem to have your support, Disch, and I thank you for that. I know I have Lenophis' support, and Ian's. I even have an 'inside man' who is willing to work with me, as far as getting test items up on the ZD server.

I have a lot to churn over and consider.
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

Dark Knight Kain
02-11-2006, 10:19 PM
I support whatever you do to improve the site.
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http://dragonsbrethren.elazulspad.net/http://dragonsbrethren.elazulspad.net/images/accept.jpg</a>
</center></P>

Atma
02-11-2006, 10:31 PM
> I seem to have your support, Disch, and I thank you for
> that. I know I have Lenophis' support, and Ian's. I even
> have an 'inside man' who is willing to work with me, as far
> as getting test items up on the ZD server.

I'd imagine you'd have the support of quite a few more people than you'd think.

Of course, I could very well be wrong.
<P ID="signature">---
do you buy stuff from http://www.play-asia.com/SOap-23-83-1wp6.htmlplay-asia</a>? if you do, help a bro out and buy from that link :) </P>

JadussD
02-11-2006, 11:37 PM
> Of course, right now it appears you (and everyone else) are
> more concerned about winning an argument and whining than
> getting any work done.
>

No one is going to waste their time when it's just going to be rejected. I've stood by and watched the deevolution of this site for years. Sorry, it's not that everyone else in the world sucks and can't get any work done, it's that no one wants to stick their necks out and have it rejected when they know damn well nothing is ever going to be good enough.
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soniczip
02-11-2006, 11:57 PM
> But once again...you mouth off and the 5 people who come to
> zmd run up behind you with pitch forks and torches blaming
> me for something I wasn't a part of.

<img src=http://www.geocities.com/ikeeyebee/mob3.jpg>
<P ID="signature">I am the law. ~ Warden of Marshwood Hill.
</P>

packardmelan
02-12-2006, 12:28 AM
For once, that was actually pretty funny. <img src=smilies/thumb.gif>
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

soniczip
02-12-2006, 12:32 AM
> For once, that was actually pretty funny.
>

Thank you!<img src=smilies/thumb.gif>
<P ID="signature">I am the law. ~ Warden of Marshwood Hill.
</P>

Viewtiful Bob
02-12-2006, 01:27 AM
> I seem to have your support, Disch, and I thank you for
> that. I know I have Lenophis' support, and Ian's. I even
> have an 'inside man' who is willing to work with me, as far
> as getting test items up on the ZD server.

You also have my support... even though I'm new to the board, I have really enjoyed the news pages and have used the emulation parts of the site a countless number of times in years passed. Now the emulation site has been full of broken links, or now link to something that doesn't exist anymore, for a long time... I support anybody that is willing to go in and fix things up. It's a HUGE site and has a lot of work on it, to ask anybody to create a finished product is asking a lot... but I don't see any problems with somebody that wants to do some tweaking to the site.
<P ID="signature"><img src=http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/9956/viewtifulbob8fz.jpg></P>

Diskeater
02-12-2006, 01:46 AM
As much as I absolutely hate to admit it, that made me smile juuuust a lil bit.
<P ID="signature">http://www.badjawa.comhttp://diskeater.homestead.com/files/signature.jpg</a></img></P>

The 9th Sage
02-12-2006, 04:06 AM
Haha, I have no idea why that's funny, but it's giving me a nice laught at the moment. <img src=smilies/laff.gif>

w00t! I'm the guy with the axe!
<P ID="signature">http://www.xanga.com/ZeldaDDhttp://x76.xanga.com/4fe1811b647a82128109/b2044670.gif


ZDD's Weblog - Now it has content! Really!</a></P>

Dark Knight Kain
02-12-2006, 04:27 AM
> Haha, I have no idea why that's funny, but it's giving me a nice laught at the moment. <img src=smilies/laff.gif>

Me too <img src=smilies/laff.gif>


> w00t! I'm the guy with the axe!

w00t! I'm the guy that gets his name at the bottom! ...wait, is that a good thing? <img src=smilies/retard.gif>
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http://dragonsbrethren.elazulspad.net/http://dragonsbrethren.elazulspad.net/images/accept.jpg</a>
</center></P>

The 9th Sage
02-12-2006, 04:28 AM
> I seem to have your support, Disch, and I thank you for
> that. I know I have Lenophis' support, and Ian's. I even
> have an 'inside man' who is willing to work with me, as far
> as getting test items up on the ZD server.

You've got my support. I haven't hung around this site (having been a moderator here for years and briefly a staffer) because I hate it...I'd love to see it get better.

I wouldn't even mind helping out if I knew EVERYONE who was going to be helping out with the site would work equally instead of having it fall to one or two people out of everyone.
<P ID="signature">http://www.xanga.com/ZeldaDDhttp://x76.xanga.com/4fe1811b647a82128109/b2044670.gif


ZDD's Weblog - Now it has content! Really!</a></P>

SwampGas
02-12-2006, 06:35 AM
> I'm not arguing in this post. I have a lot to think about
> on this... obviously, I'm not going to get the access I want
> until I have some sort of 'peace offering' - a download
> system, or something. And I'm scared to invest that time
> into it when its use isn't guaranteed when all is said and
> done.

I rip people's code apart because it's sloppy, insecure and won't be able to handle the traffic the site gets. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to explain it line by line as to why.

If you need example programming, go look at fudforum.org...that guy has his coding together. In fact, I would not be opposed to integrating fudforum to replace w3.
<P ID="signature"><marquee direction=right scrollamount=10>http://www.zophar.net/personal/swampgas/hsrun.gif</marquee></P>

SwampGas
02-12-2006, 06:42 AM
Game over.
<P ID="signature"><marquee direction=right scrollamount=10>http://www.zophar.net/personal/swampgas/hsrun.gif</marquee></P>

packardmelan
02-12-2006, 07:07 AM
> Game over.

Continue. Yes/No?
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

SwampGas
02-12-2006, 07:20 AM
> Continue. Yes/No?

Power off. Blow on cartridge. Power on.

U U D D L R L R B A ST
<P ID="signature"><marquee direction=right scrollamount=10>http://www.zophar.net/personal/swampgas/hsrun.gif</marquee></P>

packardmelan
02-12-2006, 06:14 PM
I wanted to post an update. It would appear that, for time time being, I'm part of ZD staff. My thanks go out to everyone who supported me, and argued on my behalf. My thanks go to Sam, who finally relented.

I've been told, quite clearly, that people have tried to revitalize ZD and failed. That's fine... I'm not those people. I intend to work hard on this, and I already have something going on the server. Yes, already.

I'm testing a new download system. It's one I like a lot, and once I get it filled out a little bit, I'll show it off. I'm not afraid to get the opinions of others. :)

Again, thank you. I hope I do you all proud.
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

The 9th Sage
02-12-2006, 06:16 PM
> Again, thank you. I hope I do you all proud.

Good luck. <img src=smilies/thumb.gif> Obi-Wan, you are our only hope.
<P ID="signature">http://www.xanga.com/ZeldaDDhttp://x76.xanga.com/4fe1811b647a82128109/b2044670.gif


ZDD's Weblog - Now it has content! Really!</a></P>

Diskeater
02-12-2006, 06:23 PM
Congrats man! If there is anything I can do to help out, let me know.
<P ID="signature">http://www.badjawa.comhttp://diskeater.homestead.com/files/signature.jpg</a></img></P>

JadussD
02-12-2006, 06:24 PM
> I've been told, quite clearly, that people have tried to
> revitalize ZD and failed. That's fine... I'm not those
> people. I intend to work hard on this, and I already have
> something going on the server. Yes, already.

Fuck yeah!
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Viewtiful Bob
02-12-2006, 09:44 PM
> I wanted to post an update. It would appear that, for time
> time being, I'm part of ZD staff.

Hooray!! I wish you good luck!<img src=smilies/thumb.gif><img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif>
<P ID="signature"><img src=http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/9956/viewtifulbob8fz.jpg></P>

Reaper man
02-12-2006, 11:30 PM
> Again, thank you. I hope I do you all proud.

*perpetual good luck reply*
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king killa
02-13-2006, 01:45 AM
> I'm testing a new download system. It's one I like a lot,
> and once I get it filled out a little bit, I'll show it off.
> I'm not afraid to get the opinions of others. :)
>

I'll give my opinion early. I like it, a lot. Especially the name ;)
<P ID="signature">http://hwody.comKilla's Blog</a></P>

packardmelan
02-13-2006, 03:53 AM
Here's my concept.
http://www.zophar.net/zd-concept/

The site uses CSS and various templates, which I've been editing. I waited for Sam's initial impression, and waited until I got a generic "ZD-like" color scheme before I linked it.

Basically? Poke around. Play. Tell me what's missing, and tell me what you hate about it. Don't forget to tell me a little bit of what you love too. <img src=smilies/thumb.gif>

...And yes, for anyone who might ask, I did this stuff all -today-. It uses a pre-packaged download manager, licensed under the LGPL.

And if you have any questions, just let me know.
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

pipes
02-13-2006, 04:01 AM
This is all your fault!<img src=smilies/angryfire.gif>
<P ID="signature">The pipes clangor all the time!</P>

Kitsune Sniper
02-13-2006, 04:28 AM
> Basically? Poke around. Play. Tell me what's missing, and
> tell me what you hate about it. Don't forget to tell me a
> little bit of what you love too.

I tried downloading the Boy and his Blob file, and got "Posted By: ZeldaDD on 12/02/2006 at 21:50:16" in yellow text. Unreadable, basically.
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packardmelan
02-13-2006, 04:33 AM
Nevermind, I see what you were saying. The CSS is updated...

If you're on this page: http://www.zophar.net/zd-concept/details.php?file=10

The download link is above the "File Toolbox" header. :) Not in the comments section.
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P><P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by packardmelan on 02/12/06 11:38 PM.</FONT></P>

Kitsune Sniper
02-13-2006, 04:50 AM
> Nevermind, I see what you were saying. The CSS is updated...
*snip*
> The download link is above the "File Toolbox" header. :) Not
> in the comments section.

I know. I wasn't planning on downloading the NSF, I was just poking around finding anything weird and reporting back to you. Just to try and help out a bit.
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packardmelan
02-13-2006, 05:04 AM
> This is all your fault!

http://www.gabrielwalker.com/images/zod.jpg

<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

packardmelan
02-13-2006, 05:05 AM
My bad; the way it was worded, it sounded like you tried to download the NSF, and saw some text in yellow instead of the download link.
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

SwampGas
02-13-2006, 05:13 AM
The CSS I saw earlier today is nothing like how it is now. The colors are way too dark and the the page looks crowded because of it.
<P ID="signature"><marquee direction=right scrollamount=10>http://www.zophar.net/personal/swampgas/hsrun.gif</marquee></P>

packardmelan
02-13-2006, 05:14 AM
> The CSS I saw earlier today is nothing like how it is now.
> The colors are way too dark and the the page looks crowded
> because of it.

The colors were changed to match the current ZD look as closely as possible. If you prefer the original color scheme, that can be substituted back into place.
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

Kitsune Sniper
02-13-2006, 05:18 AM
> The colors were changed to match the current ZD look as
> closely as possible. If you prefer the original color
> scheme, that can be substituted back into place.

You -are- going to allow multiple themes, right? Because I like the current color scheme (except for that yellow text thing ;P).
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packardmelan
02-13-2006, 05:22 AM
The yellow text thing was fixed. :P

As for multiple themes, the site supports it on the back end. I'm sure it could be put in as a user selection, but that depends on if Sam wants that. ;)
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

SwampGas
02-13-2006, 05:26 AM
The issue is that, apparently, no one here understands jack about web design. Go load microsoft.com, yahoo.com, google.com, et al. Compare the similarities and then you have a better idea. I was completely lost when I loaded the site with this new color scheme.

This is the problem in the past. Everyone is obsessed with this 1996 kiddie web design crap. The second I ask someone to clean it up, I'm the uncooperative bad guy.
<P ID="signature"><marquee direction=right scrollamount=10>http://www.zophar.net/personal/swampgas/hsrun.gif</marquee></P>

packardmelan
02-13-2006, 05:29 AM
> This is the problem in the past. Everyone is obsessed with
> this 1996 kiddie web design crap. The second I ask someone
> to clean it up, I'm the uncooperative bad guy.

I had the original scheme up, and the immediate reaction from the few I showed it to was "I hate the white. Make it look like the old ZD." So I did that, and opened up the link to the public. Thankfully, since it's all CSS, it's easily updated.

Note that I never called you uncooperative - Kitsune asked if the concept would allow for user-selected "themes", and I told him that would be up to you. One one hand, you may not care. On the other, you may want a consistent site look and feel, and user-selected themes might get in the way of that.

Notice that doesn't make you a "bad guy". It just asks you to make the decision of whether to allow that feature.
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

JadussD
02-13-2006, 05:39 AM
> This is the problem in the past. Everyone is obsessed with
> this 1996 kiddie web design crap. The second I ask someone
> to clean it up, I'm the uncooperative bad guy.
>

That "1996 kiddie web design" by a morbidly minded teenager is part of its charm. The freaking website is named after someone who named himself ZOPHAR, an evil villian in a cult classic Sega CD RPG and/or someone who mourned with Job. Clearly packardmelan is trying to bring the former aesthetic into a more streamlined, modern context, and I think he's suceeded well, with some kinks that need to be worked out. This is an EMULATION website, it's not Microsoft, Yahoo, it's Zophar's Domain, one of the oldest emulation websites on the Internet. Your primary audience will be teenagers (kiddies) and old schoolers who will feel right at home and nostalgic with the "1996 kiddie web design" aesthetic. You may not like it, but will those who visit Zophar's Domain? I think they will.

I have not heard one negative comment from anyone besides you. Your opinion is surely one of the most important ones, but no one else seems to think of it the way you do.I think we are closer to seeing a functional ZD again than we ever have been, and I think moving forward is more important than getting caught up in the details. Why worry about keeping your lawn trimmed when your house is on fire, you know?
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Diskeater
02-13-2006, 05:50 AM
Hey guys....do you think there should be a new thread regarding the ongoing changes?
<P ID="signature">http://www.badjawa.comhttp://diskeater.homestead.com/files/signature.jpg</a></img></P>

Kitsune Sniper
02-13-2006, 05:52 AM
> This is the problem in the past. Everyone is obsessed with
> this 1996 kiddie web design crap. The second I ask someone
> to clean it up, I'm the uncooperative bad guy.

Which is why I asked if they could be user-chosen. If a person wants to use a scheme from 1996, let them. If a user wants to use the one you like, let them. If you want to use one of your own, well, let you. Or something.

It's best to allow people to choose, because certain themes just don't sit right with people. For instance, that other theme this board had... the one with uh, brownish (?) colors? I can't read anything on it. It makes my eyes hurt because of my less-than-average vision. But this scheme is fine, and is probably the only reason I logged on while I was banned a long time ago.

*shrugs* I'm not calling you a bad guy. Nobody is. I'm just stating an opinion, and giving feedback.
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packardmelan
02-13-2006, 06:09 AM
You're welcome to make one. <img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif>
<P ID="signature">http://www.sloganizer.net/en/http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style5,Packard.png</a></P>

Ugly Joe
02-13-2006, 06:17 AM
> And if you have any questions, just let me know.

Exactly how large do you plan on making the "Categories" column? I mean, the current ZD side bar goes waaaay down the page. If you put all of this in one column (even in one collapsable column), it's going to be an unorganized mess. It's simply too much information in a single column and a bad way to go about organizing ZD's large file archive.

I would suggest mixing this categories column with some bread crumb navigation. Yahoo's been using it for years because it works. The files on ZD can be faily easily categorized so that the the crumb trails make sense. This would keep the categories column trimmed up since it would only need to show you the children of the current category, and not all of the categories at once.

As for the already mentioned style-switcher, I would say definately go for it. I can agree that there is a certain charm to ZD's dark theme, but I can also agree that black backgrounds on websites are a bad idea (and very 1996, if you want to put it that way). Style-switchers are extremely easy to implement and there are plenty that are already written. There's really no reason not to use one.

As far as the layout is concerned, I don't really like it. It's too closed in. There should be some more open room (or at least the illusion of it). You don't need to define the columns and files in such an obvious and jagged way. As long as there is some kind of header and the text below it wraps at the length of the header, the column structure will remain, but open up the page a lot more. Look at a http://sourceforge.net/projects/scummvm/sourceforge page</a> to see what I mean.

Also, as a more nit-picky issue, clicking on the "view full info" links seems to actually show you less info.

Sorry for all the negative criticism. I hope you find it to be at least somewhat constructive <img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif>
<P ID="signature">_______________________________________
http://ximwix.net/images/icons/smaller/altogether.gif (http://ximwix.net)</P>

Reaper man
02-13-2006, 06:34 AM
> Here's my concept.
> http://www.zophar.net/zd-concept/
> Basically? Poke around. Play. Tell me what's missing, and
> tell me what you hate about it. Don't forget to tell me a
> little bit of what you love too.
> And if you have any questions, just let me know.

okay, as for the layout, it looks nice, I like it. As for the source, it irked me and I'll tell you why.

There's too much of it.

the titles in the "A" tags aren't needed. I've been brousing ZD for a while; I know what the menue does. I don't need a description of where it's going each time I move the mouse. If there are people that really need such guidence, then maybe a "first timer" page needs to be made.

Also I took a look at your CSS sheet and it just looks like that there is way too much "ids" being defined. If possible, that needs to be condensed and simplified a bit more. You know put a lot of the similar elements into one "ID" and such (maybe I'm wrong, but that's what it looked like to me)

looking at this thread, I can see that Swampgas' main concern is bandwidth. You need to make this shit as condense as possible. if you have 100 extra byes of uneeded clutter on your page and let's say a 100,000 unique hits a day, that's around 10MB of wasted banwidth, and well, that adds up you know? Just something to keep in mind. Hosting ain't cheap, and we all know that the new site redesign is going to increase bandwidth whether we like it or not (unless you design it smaller than what it was originally, but I doubt it.)
<P ID="signature"></P>

packardmelan
02-13-2006, 06:57 AM
> Exactly how large do you plan on making the "Categories"
> column? I mean, the current ZD side bar goes waaaay down
> the page. If you put all of this in one column (even in one
> collapsable column), it's going to be an unorganized mess.
> It's simply too much information in a single column and a
> bad way to go about organizing ZD's large file archive.

Each category can be collapsed, and each category can be clicked on. Meaning, you can click on Emulators for Windows, go to a page, click on Consoles, go to a page, click on NES. As the categories fill up, I'll probably default to that side bar to being collapsed, so you can click and expand the tree, or just click on the initial category.

> As far as the layout is concerned, I don't really like it.

That's fine. The templating system can alter the layout in any way. All I did was edit the CSS file for colors. This is really preliminary. :) It's a concept, for the moment - more of a "This could work", rather than something ready to go live. I also want to stress that I just got started with it today, and as I learn more about the ins and outs of the template system, the more I can alter and adjust as we need. :)

> Also, as a more nit-picky issue, clicking on the "view full
> info" links seems to actually show you less info.

It's basically the same amount of info, laid out differently. That's a cheat, because I didn't fill out any "long descriptions" for the files. As I figure out what I want on those, the current files will be retrofitted.

> Sorry for all the negative criticism. I hope you find it to
> be at least somewhat constructive

Sure.
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packardmelan
02-13-2006, 07:01 AM
First off, it's not MY CSS file. It's a CSS file I've been editing, based on a default template that came with a pre-packaged download engine.

I can't stress this enough.

I also can't stress enough that these templates link to ONE CSS file, and it's not even a particularly large one. And, the majority of the site layout is done in colors, rather than graphics. Meaning, the bandwidth use would actually be fairly low.

I'm not sure what "source" you're viewing. The scripts are PHP, and you're viewing rendered HTML. ;) I could strip out the CSS file, and I could strip out the default template. There's a lot of customization that can be had.

And wait - "A new site redesign would increase bandwidth whether we like it or not"? What are you saying here?
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Reaper man
02-13-2006, 07:24 AM
> First off, it's not MY CSS file. It's a CSS file I've been
> editing, based on a default template that came with a
> pre-packaged download engine.
> I can't stress this enough.

I see. Well still I think it could be simplified a bit more, but like I said I could be wrong. I'm not an expert on this.

> I also can't stress enough that these templates link to ONE
> CSS file, and it's not even a particularly large one. And,
> the majority of the site layout is done in colors, rather
> than graphics. Meaning, the bandwidth use would actually be
> fairly low.

yeah, I noticed that too. I mean thre isn't a large graphic anymore. It's been replaced by a relatively small banner 12 KB as opposed to 16 KB which is good.

> I'm not sure what "source" you're viewing. The scripts are
> PHP, and you're viewing rendered HTML. ;)

oh yeah... heh. Like I said I'm no expert on this. :)
still the "titles" could be removed, right? and I'm pretty sure that some tweaks to the PHP scripts will yeild smaller output :)

> I could strip out the CSS file, and I could strip out the default template.
> There's a lot of customization that can be had.

leave the CSS script in there. custom style sheets are sexy ;)

> And wait - "A new site redesign would increase bandwidth
> whether we like it or not"? What are you saying here?

well you know, adding a few things here, adding a few things there, that sort of thing. I think what made the old design so nice was that it was simple, both in design and code. Sure it's outdated, but it works. I believe that all swampgas wants are 3 important things

1. that it's small and won't consume bandwidth
2. that the design is clean and easy to follow
3. and that everything is 100% functional.

That's it. I could be wrong though, but that's what I'm feeling from him *shrugs*
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king killa
02-13-2006, 11:29 AM
> Here's my concept.
> http://www.zophar.net/zd-concept/
>

Looks great, but I liked the PD logo more <img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif>
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(wraith_)
02-15-2006, 11:41 AM
> oh yeah... heh. Like I said I'm no expert on this. :)
> still the "titles" could be removed, right? and I'm pretty
> sure that some tweaks to the PHP scripts will yeild smaller
> output :)

The alt field in img tags is *required* for XHTML compliance, however alt doesn't behave in Firefox the way it does in IE (more specisifcally: alt behaves properly in Firefox), hence to get the layout to behave the same in both browsers and give all site visitors the same experience, title is required for Firefox.

also, a few hundred extra bytes of text would be negligible unless the user were running on 2400 baud modem. Clearly such a person should punched in the face. With a combat knife.

...That would really be more of stab, wouldn't it?
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Nightcrawler
02-15-2006, 09:52 PM
This arguement is quite silly. I've been in a similar situation before. This I what you do. You take the people that DO want to work on the site and go start a NEW, GOOD, site. Screw Sam, and HIS whining and reluctance to lift a finger on ZD and screw YOUR whining about him not doing it and start a new site to replace it!

Get a few people together and it's really NOT that hard to recreate databases and archives. I did it for ROMhacking.net. The emulator database IS bigger than my archives, but if you allow a good number of people to help, you can have the archive rebuilt in no time.

Also, take it from me, any new site of larger magnitude in a fickle community such as this is going to have to have user selectibility for themes. It doesn't matter WHAT theme you come up with, people will hate it. So, you provide themes selectability and tell people make their own.

So there go. Quit wasting your time argueing here and start working on a new site. Start writing some scripts and setting up your database. Put feelers out for anybody interested in hosting such site or look into hosting options yourself.

Whatever you do.. just start doing it. And start showing people results, and more people will join you and befor e you know it, you HAVE yourself a site. People respect people that are DOING things more than just talking about them.

Put your heads together,come up with features you want to will make this site BETTER than ZD. What is wrong with ZD? Why did it die? You best make sure you try to address those issues with a new site. Try to do something different and better.

You can also improve upon the GOOD things ZD has. The carry on in it's honor.
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Diskeater
02-15-2006, 10:02 PM
Its been done.
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SwampGas
02-15-2006, 10:32 PM
Hah.

I love you <img src=smilies/liefde.gif>
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Lillymon
02-15-2006, 10:58 PM
> You take the people that DO want to work on the site and go
> start a NEW, GOOD, site. Screw Sam, and HIS whining and
> reluctance to lift a finger on ZD and screw YOUR whining
> about him not doing it and start a new site to replace it!

Viva la revolution!

It's the first thing I thought of when I read that.
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Reaper man
02-16-2006, 04:51 AM
> The alt field in img tags is *required* for XHTML
> compliance, however alt doesn't behave in Firefox the way it
> does in IE (more specisifcally: alt behaves properly in
> Firefox), hence to get the layout to behave the same in both
> browsers and give all site visitors the same experience,
> title is required for Firefox.

Interesting, but I never mentioned alt titles in images though. :)
I was referring to the titles in the links on the left menu (hover your mouse over them and you'll see what I mean). It's not even consistant. The links on the top don't have them.

> also, a few hundred extra bytes of text would be negligible
> unless the user were running on 2400 baud modem. Clearly
> such a person should punched in the face. With a combat
> knife.

The loading times weren't the issue. I'm talking about bandwidth here. I'm pretty sure that the cost for running this site comes out of Swampgas' pocket. The more bloated the site is, the more bandwidth it's going to comsume, thus the more money Swampgas is going to have to fork out to keep the site going. It is in his (Swampgas) best intrest to keep the site bandwidth to a minimum, which is probably why he mentioned google, yahoo, etc. when it comes to good website design.

I dunno, that's just how I see it. I could be wrong though.
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Lenophis
02-16-2006, 07:10 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

It is in his (Swampgas) best intrest to keep the site bandwidth to a minimum, which is probably why he mentioned google, yahoo, etc. when it comes to good website design.

<hr></blockquote>
Google has good page design? The main page is a whitesheet background, one image, one edit (input) field, two buttons, and the copyright on the bottom.

Yahoo (taking forever to load) has a fuckton of links to its own shit, a whitesheet background, and the whole color scheme is pretty pastel, with links and content all over the place (which is why it takes forever for the page to load).

All in all, I don't even remember what my point is anymore. <img src=smilies/cry.gif>
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Dark Knight Kain
02-16-2006, 07:16 AM
> All in all, I don't even remember what my point is anymore.

Yahoo sucks and Google wins by default?
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sephiroth111
02-16-2006, 03:01 PM
hm. the concept seems solid to me.
One of the main problems (so i'm told) is the adding submissions being so difficult (coding the entire submission in html) so long as the submission system is user friendly that doesn't require too much direct server access (aside from uploading files of course) I dont think you'll have too much of an issue attracting mods to help post news and files.
All in all looking at the actual page itself i'd like to see the cat bar on the right side, instead of on the left
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packardmelan
02-16-2006, 10:15 PM
> One of the main problems (so i'm told) is the adding
> submissions being so difficult (coding the entire submission
> in html) so long as the submission system is user friendly
> that doesn't require too much direct server access (aside
> from uploading files of course)

That has nothing to do with this concept/engine. Click on "Add File", and you'll see that it's all integrated. ...The current system in place does require manual HTML and manual linking; which is something I looked to replace when I found this particular download manager app. :)

In other news - I know there haven't been any update in the last two days; it's been because of Valentine's Day, and because I wanted to spend time with my wife, rather than worrying about templates and everything else.

I'll be 'back to work' tonight or tomorrow, figuring out layout and every other thing.
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Keith
02-17-2006, 01:06 PM
I would suggest some more padding around the actual content information for the downloads on the main index of your demo. I find it that it makes it a bit easier to read. As for the information pages it is very hard to find the download link and the dark text doesn't make it any easier. I personaly would completely redo the file information pages since it currently seems messy to me. I am sure you are still tweaking it .. good luck on the revival. :)
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