Thought on terror...

[Lobster Cowboy]

Why don't we just betray the Israelis? Suddenly, the Arab countries would really dig us. It sure would end the threat of terror real quick, right?

[Lenophis]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

Why don't we just betray the Israelis? Suddenly, the Arab countries would really dig us. It sure would end the threat of terror real quick, right?

<hr></blockquote>
I suddenly see your IQ drop about 50 points.

[Blade556]

I'm sure the Jews haven't had enough punishment.

[Lobster Cowboy]

Where's your sense of pragmatism?

Arab nations/people always say they hate us for supprting Israel. Arab countries have more people/oil/money/land than Israel. If we sell out Israel, it benefits the US with cheaper oil, and it placates the terrorists.

Sounds like a win-win to me.

[Lenophis]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

Arab nations/people always say they hate us for supprting Israel.

<hr></blockquote>
They'll hate us for the sake of hating us.

Sounds like a lose-lose to me.

[Danoz]

> Why don't we just betray the Israelis? Suddenly, the Arab
> countries would really dig us. It sure would end the threat
> of terror real quick, right?

Yeah, who needs Jews, right? There's a historical leader I think you'd relate really well to.

[Mr. Saturn]

Show's over, folks. Godwin has left the building.

[CEpeep]

> Why don't we just betray the Israelis? Suddenly, the Arab
> countries would really dig us. It sure would end the threat
> of terror real quick, right?
>

Because then you'd be a NAZI TERRORIST, and they never get invited to parties.

[SpaceTiger]

> Where's your sense of pragmatism?

I think this is a lot closer to nihilism than pragmatism. A pragmatist would be looking for a solution that worked for everyone involved, not just for themselves.

[icenine0]

I think, at this point, they're probably blowing us up for the sake of blowing us up. Probably had twenty dozen martyrs by now...

As an aside, though, we have a skewed perception of Israel in this country. We don't exactly hear about it when a shell goes astray and blows up a random Palestinian school. That's not to say they're bad, but I don't think their hands are squeaky clean.

> Why don't we just betray the Israelis? Suddenly, the Arab
> countries would really dig us. It sure would end the threat
> of terror real quick, right?

[Tsyni]

> I think this is a lot closer to nihilism than pragmatism. A
> pragmatist would be looking for a solution that worked for
> everyone involved, not just for themselves.

A nihilist probably wouldn't have a problem, haha..

I think that even if we sold out Israel most Arabs that hate the US would still hate the US for religious based reasons.

[Fla Flash]

Great idea.
And I'm the Tooth Fairy.
Explain that idea at a synogogue this coming saturday.
*side note: Are you on Nytol or something?*

[soniczip]

> Why don't we just betray the Israelis? Suddenly, the Arab
> countries would really dig us. It sure would end the threat
> of terror real quick, right?
>

Hmm..... I believe that we have a Neo-Whimsical person here besides me and Rai! YAY!
Another random thought: I wonder what the world would be like if everyone were made of cheez-its?

[soniczip]

> Yeah, who needs Jews, right? There's a historical leader I
> think you'd relate really well to.
>

Could. Not. Agree. More.

[Danoz]

> Show's over, folks. Godwin has left the building.

I thought that, but seriously... could it be more justified here? Where somebody essentially says that we should leave the Jewish people to their fate...

[Danoz]

I really hate that I'm justifying this with a response, but what the hell. What do you mean by “sell out Israel”? They’ve certainly done a stellar job of defending their homeland from neighboring nations, even in the face of full scale attacks from all directions. So, would you advocate a US occupation of Israel? Aiding the surrounding nations? Voting against Israel in the United Nations? What the hell are you talking about? You’ve presented, in one extremely short-sighted sentence, what little you perceive to be the solution to ending terrorism. What did it cost you? You’ve appeased the demands of Bin Laden in his pre-election home video and proved to every terrorist in the world that you’re more than willing to fold under pressure. You think the demands will stop there?

I write this with a fool’s hope that you realize, somehow, you ridiculous you sound :)

[Danoz]

I think therefore you are.

[CEpeep]

> Why don't we just betray the Israelis? Suddenly, the Arab
> countries would really dig us. It sure would end the threat
> of terror real quick, right?
>

Don't get me wrong here. I don't like Israel. Any country that is set up solely to provide a home for people of its religion (at the exclusion and possibly destruction of anyone else) is not at all deserving of my sympathy. On the other hand, if we (we as in the UN as a whole) abandoned them, they'd get blown to smitherines by their neighbors. Millions of people with no say in anything would die. I'm not sure how that solves anything.

[Danoz]

Over 20% of the citizens in Israel aren't Jewish, they're Muslim/Christian etc. It's a Jewish State, but it's not religiously exclusive as there are many who take a more secular stand as well. Actually, Israel is a parliamentary Democracy.

[CEpeep]

> Over 20% of the citizens in Israel aren't Jewish, they're
> Muslim/Christian etc. It's a Jewish State, but it's not
> religiously exclusive as there are many who take a more
> secular stand as well. Actually, Israel is a parliamentary
> Democracy.

Sure, but the purpose (and the reason it was set up) was as a Jewish State, and it's still referred to as such. No matter what the country, there will always be a need for people to move there for various opportunities, whether they're Jewish or not. A guy I used to work with just took a job in Kuwait a few months ago, but that doesn't mean that Kuwait isn't still an Islamic country just because he moved there.

[Dark Knight Kain]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

Don't get me wrong here. I don't like Israel. Any country that is set up solely to provide a home for people of its religion (at the exclusion and possibly destruction of anyone else) is not at all deserving of my sympathy. On the other hand, if we (we as in the UN as a whole) abandoned them, they'd get blown to smitherines by their neighbors. Millions of people with no say in anything would die. I'm not sure how that solves anything.

<hr></blockquote>

If we support Israel we should also be supporting the rest of the middle east, by supporting Isreal we're helping murder Palestinians who's land was stolen from them. Israel can steal all the land they want, but we shouldn't be supporting them for doing it, that just doesn't make any sense to me... look at these figures:

http://www.ifamericansknew.org/http://www.ifamericansknew.org/</a>

My problem with Israel is that everyone seems them as a friend to the US, when their own government says they don't need the US (And yet they keep taking the money...), and people see Israel as the "good guys" and Palestine as the "bad guys", I see them both as the bad guys, and we really shouldn't be supporting any of them.

[Isildur]

> I write this with a fool's hope that you realize, somehow,
> you ridiculous you sound :)
>

I think he was finding the backroom boring and decided to poke a hornets' nest. In any case, I disagree with the idea he tossed in the ring on several grounds. For one thing, I think it simply wouldn't work in the long term, because it wouldn't solve the the problem of Islamic extremism. If anything it would embolden terrorists, by indicatiing that terrorism works (which, it may be noted, is why Hezbollah received a boost in popularity in Lebanon, following Israel's withdrawal from southern Lebanon in 2000).
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[Stonerfuck]

Israel would probaly whoop our ass if we went to war with them or pissed them off. One of the most well eqipped and trained militaries in the world.
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[JadussD]

> Israel would probaly whoop our ass if we went to war with
> them or pissed them off. One of the most well eqipped and
> trained militaries in the world.

I wonder if we put the "cause the plane to go into a tail spin" backdoor into all of those fighter planes we sold them...
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[Stonerfuck]

> I wonder if we put the "cause the plane to go into a tail
> spin" backdoor into all of those fighter planes we sold
> them...

I doubt it, seeing that they take the F-16s we sell them and improve them in various ways making them better than than the ones we have in service/

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[Isildur]

> I doubt it, seeing that they take the F-16s we sell them and
> improve them in various ways making them better than than
> the ones we have in service/
>

http://www.zophar.net/wwwthreads/attachment.php?Cat=&Board=backroom&Post=277428







Seriously, though, however well-trained IDF may be, it could never win against the U.S. military (not that the scenario will ever come up anyway). You apparently don't understand the difference in sheer scale between the two forces.
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C:ServerxampphtdocszopharoldwwwthreadsattachmentsI sraeli F-16 with laser sharks.jpg

[Stonerfuck]

> Seriously, though, however well-trained IDF may be, it
> could never win against the U.S. military (not that the
> scenario will ever come up anyway). You apparently don't
> understand the difference in sheer scale between the two
> forces.
>

WTF, we cant even win a war against a few thousand lightly armed insurgents.
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[Isildur]

> WTF, we cant even win a war against a few thousand lightly
> armed insurgents.
>

That's because our hands are tied by the fact that we don't want to go all out on them, because it would cause massive collateral damage, and that would defeat the purpose of staying there in the first place. Fighting battles and keeping peace in occupied civilian areas are entirely different issues. Israel hasn't had an easy time with respect to insurgents and terrorists either-- not because of a lack of firepower or tactical skill, but because, once again, what is being fought is not a battle in the traditional sense.
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