Just knowing things [Archive] - Zophar's Message Domain

SwampGas

01-21-2004, 07:23 AM

My sister got into some trouble recently. She said where she was by using the guy's nickname...as soon as I heard the nickname, I also heard the full name (in my head). I told my parents the kid's name. I told them her friends are being coaxed into talking against her to the police. I told them to expect her to get charged.

I also had no idea about any of this...I just kind of started talking.

I found out today that I was correct with everything. The kid's name was exactly as I had said it...and I made up some story about going to high school with him so they didn't think I was nuts. She was charged as I had predicted.

This ability (or gift?) is becoming more and more prominent. I'm hearing stuff and getting thoughts on a daily basis now. I think of someone's name and I'm suddenly flooded with thoughts about them, words to describe them, etc. I can do it best as I'm falling asleep because that's probably the closest I get to a relaxed and meditated state....but occasionally it'll just come to me during the day when I need the info.

Hum...<img src=smilies/eek5.gif>

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fairykiller

01-21-2004, 01:40 PM

> I think of someone's name and I'm suddenly flooded
> with thoughts about them, words to describe them, etc.

It's really tempting to ask you if you mind if I give you a name and see what you come up with (obviously, you don't have to do it, and if you did but nothing came to you then I wouldn't take that to mean that you're wrong about things as a matter of course). In fact, this request doesn't stem from a need to make you 'prove' anything, since I have said before that I don't think that can be done. This is just out of mild curiosity to see how you do. Unless it only happens randomly and not specifically when you try, I don't know.

Either way, if the request offends or upsets you in any way, I apologize and I won't say any more about it.

http://www.angelfire.com/tx3/sfa/lld_logo02.jpg

phonymike

01-21-2004, 04:09 PM

My name is Mike, my mom's side of the family calls me 'Mikey', and my sister calls me 'monkey boy'. Tell me what you come up with! $100 and the cover of Time if you come up with my last name.

Richter X

01-21-2004, 11:57 PM

Sounds like you've got something like I've got. Except yours works differently than mine. Mine dealing with TV shows and yours dealing with peoples' names. Too bad I can't remember some peoples' names most of the time.

I don't die... I just ascend.

MooglyGuy

01-22-2004, 02:47 AM

Personally, I believe that everyone has at least a little psychic ability, you just need to be "in tune" for it to happen. There have been times when my mother has said something that I was thinking, after no lead-in whatsoever to the subject, though I'm sure this has happened to everyone. Also, my mother and her sister seem to have some sort of connection in that there have been times when one of them has gone to call the other, picked up the phone, and the other is already on the line without the phone having rung. They've met with each other wearing almost the exact same things after having not seen each other for several years, they've both put up the exact same wallpaper and curtains without any communication... it's pretty creepy, and it's not like they live just next door either, for most of the time I've been alive we've lived in upstate NY and my aunt and her kids have lived in New Jersey.

So, um, as much as I'd like to continue my disbelief and claim that you're full of it like I tried to say with that communicating-with-spirits thing, I do indeed believe you with this. <img src=smilies/erm.gif>

http://www.zophar.net/Files/mooglish.png
"Kupo, motherfucker!! DO YOU SPEAK IT!?"

Tsyni

01-22-2004, 03:24 AM

Ya i think everyone has a bit of magic etc...we could start a captain planet type deal, swamp has the power of names, richter has the power of tv, we need a few more but we are on a roll.

--//--
What do you do, how tired do you get when each day you struggle against an entire culture based on the normalization of trauma-inducing behavior? There is no sanctuary.Edited by Tsyni on 01/21/04 11:30 PM.

SwampGas

01-22-2004, 05:22 AM

Like I said...it's not fully developed and it's only beginning. I was told that this is a "training" period and it's hit or miss because most of the stuff is being filtered from me so I don't get overwhelmed.

Eric or Derrick. Any coincidence I thought of those names?

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SwampGas

01-22-2004, 05:22 AM

> My name is Mike, my mom's side of the family calls me
> 'Mikey', and my sister calls me 'monkey boy'. Tell me what
> you come up with! $100 and the cover of Time if you come up
> with my last name.

It doesn't work like that <img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif>

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maq112k2

01-22-2004, 03:16 PM

On that subject, seeing as to how you seem to be knowing alot about this, you might be able to help me understand this. This happens quite alot, where I go to sleep, dream of something, and completely forget about the dream--until what I dreamt about happens. Usually it's not for a while that it happens, it just does. Not all dreams, just really random ones. It seems like its deja vu, like it's already happened. I dunno. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

--------------------------
(>'.')>

fairykiller

01-22-2004, 04:17 PM

> Eric or Derrick. Any coincidence I thought of those names?

Don't think I know any Erics or Derricks that could be important...

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SwampGas

01-22-2004, 05:21 PM

> Don't think I know any Erics or Derricks that could be
> important...

Someone was bugging me last night. I was told:

- "We met at Mags"
- 'I'm a firefighter" (or maybe he said fireman)
- "Our wedding party had Mark in it"

Not sure who it was meant for, but it was VERY clear.

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fairykiller

01-22-2004, 05:32 PM

> - "We met at Mags"
> - 'I'm a firefighter" (or maybe he said fireman)
> - "Our wedding party had Mark in it"

> Not sure who it was meant for, but it was VERY clear.

Doesn't seem like it was meant for me (although I should register my skepticism that it was meant for anyone). I've met a fireman once, my friend's boyfriend, and she dressed up in his clothes for the drag party last night. That's the closest I get.

http://www.angelfire.com/tx3/sfa/lld_logo02.jpg

SwampGas

01-22-2004, 05:48 PM

> Doesn't seem like it was meant for me (although I should
> register my skepticism that it was meant for anyone). I've
> met a fireman once, my friend's boyfriend, and she dressed
> up in his clothes for the drag party last night. That's the
> closest I get.

Like I said...it just started "working" recently and most of the information is being filtered so I'm not overwhelmed. As I was falling asleep last night I heard a male voice, VERY loud and clear, saying "We met at Mags". Then I heard "I was a firefighter" (or fireman). Then I heard "Our wedding party had Mark in it". At that point I wrote it down, which broke my concentration. No response when I asked a name or why he was telling me.

This is all quite confusing. I'll probably be of better use once I learn to properly control it.

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StormsInHerEyes

01-22-2004, 05:54 PM

YEAH WELL WHY DONT YOU GET THOUGHTS ABOUT ME AND ANSWER YOUR DAMN PHONE!!!!!!!! <img src=smilies/angryfire.gif><img src=smilies/angryfire.gif><img src=smilies/angryfire.gif><img src=smilies/angryfire.gif>

http://www.digikitten.com/gallery/data/507/5105signature_alba03.jpg

fairykiller

01-22-2004, 06:02 PM

> This is all quite confusing. I'll probably be of better use
> once I learn to properly control it.

I think it's normal to 'hear' voices as you drift off to sleep or right before you sleep. There's a reason for it, something to do with the brain, I can look it up. What's not normal is if you feel you are actually hearing these voices (ie, not in your head, but through your physical aural sense, through your ears). My textbook also has something rather lucid to say about that, but I'm guessing you're already working on a premise that textbooks don't cover. I'm curious though - do you think it is your thoughts (ie, voices in your head) that have significance, or are you actually hearing things through your sense of hearing?

http://www.angelfire.com/tx3/sfa/lld_logo02.jpg

shawn

01-22-2004, 08:53 PM

That's called intuition, usually occurs in people who are highly intelligent and have a strong subconscious thought train and that voice is called an inner voice. You see this ability a lot with police detectives *they sometimes call it a gut feeling*, scientists, inventors, ect. , so feel very lucky to have this natural mental talent since it is rare to have it in someone as young as yourself since it usually takes years of experience and you would usually see it in someone if they had this talent over the age of 30 and probably more like over 40 or even 50. The reason for the higher age is that your brains subconscious is making an instant answer from a vague situation by instantly sorting through tons and tons of knowledge and experience and that more or less means you have a mind that works better than most. <img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif>

sephiroth111

01-23-2004, 01:21 AM

> Personally, I believe that everyone has at least a little
> psychic ability, you just need to be "in tune" for it to
> happen.

yeah, i can tell what things are gonna happen 2 units in advance. like in an rpg, in battle i can tell what move the enemy will use 2 turns from the current turn, though it gets harder to do it after awhile (like my mind gets exausted) it works in double or nothing in poker too =)

<hr>
Ludvuck Foruk: Thats your first problem...thinking your a panda...
sephiroth111: and once again, i am totally confused as to whats going on.

SwampGas

01-23-2004, 03:32 AM

> YEAH WELL WHY DONT YOU GET THOUGHTS ABOUT ME AND ANSWER YOUR
> DAMN PHONE!!!!!!!!

You call while I'm at work. Talking on a phone is not permitted.

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SwampGas

01-23-2004, 03:34 AM

Incorrect. I'm getting answers that I don't know beforehand. How was I supposed to know who he is? Steven Hawking couldn't even "just know" a name he never heard of before unless he possessed an ability beyond "being smart".

FYI, that "inner voice" is not inner. It's your guide talking to you.

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SwampGas

01-23-2004, 03:37 AM

> do you think it is your thoughts (ie,
> voices in your head) that have significance, or are you
> actually hearing things through your sense of hearing?

I only physically heard a voice once. I knew I wasn't alone in the room and said "look, I know you're here...but I can't see you," and he said--outloud--"yeah..."

The reason for getting the information more clearly before sleep is because you're relaxed. The alpha waves in the brain change. It's similar to meditation and concentration.

It's just "hearing" talk. It's just "knowing" stuff as well.

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Canar

01-24-2004, 01:49 AM

Please continue posting anecdotes like these. I find them enlightening for some reason. They bolster my belief in a world outside of that which is scientifically verifiable, and I need more of that.

The problem is that today's religions are 99% ritual, 1% spirituality. <img src=smilies/headshake.gif>

Edit/comment:

<blockquote>and I made up some story about going to high school with him so they didn't think I was nuts.</blockquote>

Would they have assumed that you were nuts if you had left the story out? It seems that if there are powers that you are in league with, they could find the deception about the source of the knowledge objectionable.Edited by Canar on 01/23/04 09:52 PM.

SwampGas

01-24-2004, 07:07 AM

> The problem is that today's religions are 99% ritual, 1%
> spirituality.

I don't do the ritual thing. I don't go to church, I don't do the typical prayers and I most certainly don't do the normal Judo-Christian routine.

When I address God, I speak as if I was talking to my best friend....which is probably contrary to the typical religious belief. Last night when I addressed those around me, I said "okay fellas...let's do this" or "time to roll VIP" or "dude...I need some help."

Sure, there needs to be a distinction between talking to a human and talking to God or his angelic servants...but it feels impersonal and insincere if I follow the typical ritual. Most notably, I don't like saying "Lord". I just call him "God". If you go back to the Torah, "God" isn't even a name....He doesn't have one.

> Would they have assumed that you were nuts if you had left
> the story out? It seems that if there are powers that you
> are in league with, they could find the deception about the
> source of the knowledge objectionable.

It's not their place to judge that...how I use the ability is completely up to me. I have free will. One thing I'm NOT going to do is have people think I'm nuts. I need to fully develop and control the ability before I start telling friends and family about it; hence the reason why I post online--they don't see it.

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mFC

01-24-2004, 07:42 AM

> If you go back to the Torah, "God" isn't
> even a name....He doesn't have one.

could be wrong (havent studied religion in a while)... but god is sometimes referred to as yahweh, which is hebrew for "i am who i am"
exodus 3:13-15 for example.

Chris

<center>/personal/mfc/sig.jpg</center>

SwampGas

01-24-2004, 08:21 AM

The different names of God are simply ways of saying who he is without calling him a sacred name. You're permitted to type "God" on a PC, because you're not destroying his name when it disappears from the screen. If you print this out and destroy the paper, then you're desecrating the name of God.

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Lillymon

01-24-2004, 09:58 AM

> The different names of God are simply ways of saying who he
> is without calling him a sacred name. You're permitted to
> type "God" on a PC, because you're not destroying his name
> when it disappears from the screen. If you print this out
> and destroy the paper, then you're desecrating the name of
> God.

Does that mean you're not going to purge any messages with the word "God" in them then?

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IceWolf20

01-24-2004, 04:03 PM

> The different names of God are simply ways of saying who he
> is without calling him a sacred name. You're permitted to
> type "God" on a PC, because you're not destroying his name
> when it disappears from the screen. If you print this out
> and destroy the paper, then you're desecrating the name of
> God.

Exactly....and if you were to get a hold of any Orthodox writings, you'd probably see something like "G-d" to reference Him b/c they do not even want to write the sacredness of His name.

<div align="center">http://stuorgs.lvc.edu/acm/_private/ZMD.gif
...the way to be!</div>

SwampGas

01-24-2004, 05:35 PM

> Does that mean you're not going to purge any messages with
> the word "God" in them then?

You didn't read a word I said. Reread that post and you'll find the answer. <img src=smilies/upeyes.gif>

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Lillymon

01-25-2004, 05:44 AM

> You didn't read a word I said. Reread that post and you'll
> find the answer.

When it disappears from the screen, it remains in the forum database. Are you now saying data isn't real because it isn't tangible? Just like God isn't real because he isn't... oh wait.

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SwampGas

01-25-2004, 07:30 AM

> When it disappears from the screen, it remains in the forum
> database. Are you now saying data isn't real because it
> isn't tangible?

The law says that you may not write the "name" of God on a permanent medium and then destroy that medium because you would be desecrating His name. It was decided that computers are not a permanent medium and therefore alright to write His name.

> Just like God isn't real because he isn't...
> oh wait.

If you cannot respect my beliefs, get out of these conversations and get off my board <img src=smilies/angryfire.gif>

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Dark Macc

01-25-2004, 07:35 AM

> The law says [...]

So it's illegal and you can get arrested for it? <img src=smilies/eek13.gif>

SpaceTiger

01-25-2004, 07:37 AM

> > The law says [...]
>
> So it's illegal and you can get arrested for it?

I think he means religious law, not state or federal.

http://qonos.princeton.edu/nbond/tiger5.bmp

Lillymon

01-25-2004, 09:13 AM

> If you cannot respect my beliefs, get out of these
> conversations and get off my board

I do this to anyone religious who I can find. I must say, you're especially easy to antagonize.

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SwampGas

01-25-2004, 05:38 PM

> I do this to anyone religious who I can find. I must say,
> you're especially easy to antagonize.

Not really....it's quite simple. Respect them or be gone.

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MooglyGuy

01-25-2004, 06:05 PM

> Not really....it's quite simple. Respect them or be gone.
>

"Hello, I'm SwampGas. My belief is the One True Belief. If you believe anything apart from what spews forth from my mouth, you are wrong."

http://www.zophar.net/Files/mooglish.png
"Kupo, motherfucker!! DO YOU SPEAK IT!?"

Canar

01-26-2004, 02:43 AM

> "Hello, I'm SwampGas. My belief is the One True Belief. If
> you believe anything apart from what spews forth from my
> mouth, you are wrong."

Factoid:
believe != respect

Respect is a fundamental societal element which unfortunately far too many people lack a proper appreciation for. If you can't respect other people's views on a web board, you deserve a ban. Note that the "you" doesn't refer to TheOtherMoogle, just people in general. Yay for linguistic ambiguity.

Tsyni

01-26-2004, 02:58 AM

> Factoid:
> believe != respect

> If you can't respect other people's views on a web
> board, you deserve a ban.

I don't think moogles point had anything to do with respecting swamps view, he was commenting that sometimes swamp acts as if only his view is right and anything else is false. Personally I try and take it as him saying "in my opinion..." but sometimes he seems to overrule other peoples comments on their doubts about his beliefs, which are obviously just their opinions as well, heh...

--//--
What do you do, how tired do you get when each day you struggle against an entire culture based on the normalization of trauma-inducing behavior? There is no sanctuary.Edited by Tsyni on 01/25/04 11:03 PM.

shawn

01-26-2004, 02:59 AM

> Yay for linguistic ambiguity.

Hahahahahahaha, I love that saying, it's definitely now on my keeper list. <img src=smilies/thumb.gif>

MooglyGuy

01-26-2004, 03:29 AM

> If you can't respect other people's views on a web
> board, you deserve a ban.

So basically, what you're saying is that it's perfectly fine when Swamp says that all beliefs other than his are wrong, but when we disagree with his own beliefs , we're in the wrong wrong. Correct?

http://www.zophar.net/Files/mooglish.png
"Kupo, motherfucker!! DO YOU SPEAK IT!?"

Tsyni

01-26-2004, 03:36 AM

> So basically, what you're saying is that it's perfectly fine
> when Swamp says that all beliefs other than his are wrong,
> but when we disagree with his own beliefs , we're in the
> wrong wrong. Correct?

tell it like it is brother, hell ya, booya to your ass-mar...

--//--
What do you do, how tired do you get when each day you struggle against an entire culture based on the normalization of trauma-inducing behavior? There is no sanctuary.

Lillymon

01-26-2004, 05:11 AM

> Not really....it's quite simple. Respect them or be gone.

I'm having too much fun trying to get the top ZMD score on pya! (http://pya.cc/pyaimg/pimg.php?imgid=2437), so although I still hold absolutely no respect for your beliefs, I'm not going to take the risk that you may ban me.

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Narvick

01-26-2004, 05:50 AM

It's tough being Christian sometimes :P Bleh

:o...?

SpaceTiger

01-26-2004, 05:52 AM

> So basically, what you're saying is that it's perfectly fine
> when Swamp says that all beliefs other than his are wrong,
> but when we disagree with his own beliefs , we're in the
> wrong wrong. Correct?

Lillymon already said she was just trying to antagonize him, so I don't blame him for getting upset. The idea that God isn't real because he isn't tangible is a perfectly valid viewpoint, but it's kind of mean to mock somebody with it.

http://qonos.princeton.edu/nbond/tiger5.bmp

Lillymon

01-26-2004, 06:02 AM

> Lillymon already said she was just trying to antagonize him,
> so I don't blame him for getting upset. The idea that God
> isn't real because he isn't tangible is a perfectly valid
> viewpoint, but it's kind of mean to mock somebody with it.

He believes one intangible 'thing' is real, but another intangible thing can't be classifed as real as something like paper. Smells like a contradiction to me. Which is one thing that constantly pisses me off about religious people.

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SpaceTiger

01-26-2004, 06:13 AM

> He believes one intangible 'thing' is real, but another
> intangible thing can't be classifed as real as something
> like paper. Smells like a contradiction to me. Which is one
> thing that constantly pisses me off about religious people.

He was giving a description of what he (and his religion) took to be sacred. He didn't at any point say that intagible things were necessarily unreal. I would imagine that the reason for the distinction between purging messages on a computer and destroying a piece of paper arises from the symbolism. It's like flag-burning. There are ways to destroy a flag that are considered respectful and there are ways that aren't and the difference between them is determined by the emotional reaction to the symbolism. It's just a function of culture and tradition.

That's not to say that I don't agree with you about the logic thing. I personally believe that logic is important to any kind of belief system one might have, but I try to respect when others feel differently. I don't think what you said was horribly mean or anything, but it was a bit rude.

http://qonos.princeton.edu/nbond/tiger5.bmp

Narvick

01-26-2004, 06:38 AM

Quite frankly, if you truly believe in God, than it's much more than simply believing. Even though He's intangible, I KNOW he's there. If someone threatened to kill me if I didn't denounce God, I wouldn't. There's nothing more to it. However, a part of Christianity people forget is tolerance. Most people would be enraged over Lillymon's cynical quip, but this is where you have to be strong. Blessed are the ones who are spat upon and persecuted for your beliefs, for the Kingdom of Heaven will be yours. It's okay. I pray God that you will find a way to Lillymon. Until that is done, there's nothing I can do.

:o...?

Lillymon

01-26-2004, 06:47 AM

Sometimes, it amazes me how a patched-up tribal handbook can still rope so many people in. Then I remember that humanity is still only part way through its evolution and until it's finished, many will still need to look to imaginary beings to find meaning in life.

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Narvick

01-26-2004, 07:55 AM

Who knows where we'll end up at the end of the evoluationary process? I don't, that's for sure. But if you think it's just a mere 'patched up tribal book'...well that's just absurd. I mean, if you look at every religious text out of there, you can call them all pointless and manmade. I know it's much more than that because one of my best friends asks for guidance in life. He then turns to a random page in the Bible and the answer is right there in front of him almost every time. I've seen it happen. For Christians, it's not believing. It's knowing. There's no "I think" about it. It is and that's that. But you know, if someone else doesn't believe it, that doesn't mean that I can sit here and say all sorts of nonsensical blather about it like some of us

:o...?

Lillymon

01-26-2004, 08:37 AM

> But if you think it's just a mere 'patched up tribal book'...well that's
> just absurd.

Why's that? My theory is that it was made up by really clever guys over time to answer people's philosophical questions and get them to concentrate on life. Several others have edited it to serve their own uses such as controlling a population with the fear of hell or to tell people that homosexuality is immoral so everyone will have children and boost population.

> I mean, if you look at every religious text out of there, you can call
> them all pointless and manmade.

Because there's so many of them. If the choices were more limited, then even I might take it more seriously. If there were truly a God, wouldn't he make it more clear which religion to follow?

> I know it's much more than that because one of my best friends
> asks for guidance in life. He then turns to a random page in the
> Bible and the answer is right there in front of him almost
> every time. I've seen it happen.

Yeah, and I've seen people swear that horoscopes are true and always right. The human mind has an amazing capability of being able to twist words around so they seem more relevant to them.

> For Christians, it's not believing. It's knowing. There's no "I
> think" about it. It is and that's that. But you know, if someone
> else doesn't believe it, that doesn't mean that I can sit here
> and say all sorts of nonsensical blather about it like some
> of us.

No, you believe. I believe too. We just believe in opposite things. Neither of us can prove that we are right, therefore, neither of us can 'know'. Believe in what you want, but don't desecrate the English language like this.

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Narvick

01-26-2004, 09:23 AM

> Yeah, and I've seen people swear that horoscopes are true
> and always right. The human mind has an amazing capability
> of being able to twist words around so they seem more
> relevant to them.

It has nothing to do with twisting words around at all. Quite simply, you don't believe so you don't know. It's that simple.

> No, you believe. I believe too. We just believe in opposite
> things. Neither of us can prove that we are right,
> therefore, neither of us can 'know'. Believe in what you
> want, but don't desecrate the English language like this.

Nope. I know. And you can't tell me what I do and do not know. But what's this desecration of the English language you're talking about?

:o...?

SwampGas

01-26-2004, 09:29 AM

> Which is one
> thing that constantly pisses me off about religious people.

I'm NOT religious. Religion and spirituality are different.

I don't go to church.
I don't convert people.
I don't keep kosher.
I don't impose my beliefs on others.
I don't announce that someone is going to hell if they don't believe.
etc..etc...etc...

I'm slowly piecing things together for me...it happened in early November when I got back from a trip to Virginia. I may even be wrong about my interpretation because all of the events haven't happened yet...but...

1) I was suddenly inspired to research paranormal activity (ghosts).
2) When doing so, I allowed a negative entity into my life.
3) By talking to ghost hunters and such, I met up with psychics and learned.
4) I started communicating (through physical means) which strengthened the psychic side of things.
5) I had to remove the negative entity so I learned what "faith" really is.
6) By continued communication with psychics, I've learned why I do a lot of things I do and that it's typical of newbie psychics who haven't fully developed their abilities.

Basically, I had the shit scared out of me by getting involved with ghosts and negative entities...that was God's way of saying "you're a pain in the ass and there's more to your existence than just you."

Then I had to research the "God" stuff so I would be well-versed when dealing with said entities. In doing so, I realized what a piece of shit I had become over the years and how easily I was influenced by said entities.

When I cleansed myself and my home, I let it all go...all the anger, hatred, tension and regret. I have only 1 event in my life that I haven't let go of yet because it was never properly dealt with...or even fully put to a close. That will continue to haunt me (no pun intended) because I doubt I'll ever get the chance. I consider that my punishment.

So now here I am...I accept my life as it is. I accept what has happened to me. I accept what will happen to me. I accepted God and said "what do you want me to do? I eagerly await your answer..." and the answer becomes clearer each day.

Being at peace with yourself and with God doesn't make me religious. I'm content without all the religious nonsense.

Lilly, why don't you just ask your guardian angel or guide(s) to try and deliver a message to me? They're more than willing to talk to you and give you advice.

Spiritual? Yes. Religious? No.

My latest message was from a male voice:

We met at Mags
I'm a firefighter
Our wedding party had Mark in it

No idea who it was for or what it means. I still have trouble hearing or "knowing" who is talking to me and what the message is for.

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Lillymon

01-26-2004, 09:35 AM

> It has nothing to do with twisting words around at all.
> Quite simply, you don't believe so you don't know. It's
> that simple.

You say I don't believe so I don't know, I say you've blinded yourself to the facts that are right under your nose. Which of us is right? We could debate that all day, but we'll never come to an answer because neither of our minds are advanced enough to know for sure.

> Nope. I know. And you can't tell me what I do and do not
> know. But what's this desecration of the English language
> you're talking about?

This (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=know) is the definition of know, this (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=believe) is the definition of believe. Here's a quote from the latter:

"To have firm faith, especially religious faith."

Your faith is very firm indeed, but it still doesn't qualify as knowledge.

<marquee direction=left scrollamount=8><img src=http://home.graffiti.net/lillymon:graffiti.net/images/keletav.gif></marquee>
!luos ruoy tae lliw stelek ehT

SwampGas

01-26-2004, 09:45 AM

> Your faith is very firm indeed, but it still doesn't qualify
> as knowledge.

This is not blind faith.

I have SEEN this. As in with my own two eyes. I have FELT it. As in being touched, getting emotions, getting moods and even in a metaphorical sense. I have HEARD this. As in I get speeches and conversation every night.

I had a strange affinity to a particular latin phrase...and I was just recently "told" what I was missing:

Scientia est potentia; non timere. Morituri te salutant.

Knowledge is power, be not afraid. Those who are about to die, we greet you.

It can be translated several different ways...

Knowledge is power, fear not.
Knowledge is power, you are not to be afraid.
Those who are about to die, we wish you well.

The point is, I had an affinity towards the 2nd sentence..they were delivering a message to me saying "hey man...don't sweat it. We're here." I, like you, demanded proof...so I got it. They then completed it by telling me 'knowledge is power'...and I was obviously FREAKED out from it (there are people standing behind you right now...trust me)..so they told me not to be afraid of this new knowledge. I also interpret it that I have power over my abilities and power over the entities bothering me.

Either way, I have knowledge. I've experienced it.

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SwampGas

01-26-2004, 09:47 AM

> Neither of us can prove that we are right,
> therefore, neither of us can 'know'.

I'm not trying to prove anything to you...I hope you didn't interpret my original post as such. The fact still remains that *I* have proof...and that's all I need.

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Narvick

01-26-2004, 11:14 AM

> Either way, I have knowledge. I've experienced it.

I've experienced things too. I'm glad someone else has.

:o...?

Lillymon

01-27-2004, 09:15 AM

> I have SEEN this. As in with my own two eyes. I have FELT
> it. As in being touched, getting emotions, getting moods
> and even in a metaphorical sense. I have HEARD this. As in
> I get speeches and conversation every night.

Have you tried seeing a psychiatrist? You may be describing your own descent into madness.

> I had a strange affinity to a particular latin phrase...and
> I was just recently "told" what I was missing:

> Scientia est potentia; non timere. Morituri te salutant.

> Knowledge is power, be not afraid. Those who are about to
> die, we greet you.

You heard voices in your head? But you're not worried?

<marquee direction=left scrollamount=8><img src=http://home.graffiti.net/lillymon:graffiti.net/images/keletav.gif></marquee>
!luos ruoy tae lliw stelek ehT

SwampGas

01-27-2004, 05:50 PM

> Have you tried seeing a psychiatrist? You may be describing
> your own descent into madness.

Why is it that talking to God is praying, but God talking to you is being crazy? <img src=smilies/headshake.gif>

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fairykiller

01-27-2004, 06:34 PM

> You heard voices in your head? But you're not worried?

People hear voices in their heads all the time. He just thinks his have meaning. Different people find meaning in different places in their lives. Honestly, he heard you the first time, now just try giving another person with a different point of view some respect for a change. I would worry about insanity only if these voices are actually being physically heard, in which case my abnormal psychology book from last semester insists that they are auditory hallucinations.

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SwampGas

01-27-2004, 06:39 PM

> different point of view some respect for a change. I would
> worry about insanity only if these voices are actually being
> physically heard, in which case my abnormal psychology book
> from last semester insists that they are auditory
> hallucinations.

It's not even "hearing" them. It's more like they're being projected into my head...like not even when you "talk" in your head. It's more like when you're just thinking, except it's in a different sounding voice.

Hard to explain. <img src=smilies/banghead.gif>

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MooglyGuy

01-27-2004, 07:53 PM

> Why is it that talking to God is praying, but God talking to
> you is being crazy?

People like Lillymon would say that talking to God is equally as crazy. I feel she's wrong and I disagree with her strongly, but Swamp, sometimes you just can't convince all of the assholes in the world. It's not worth the time and effort.

http://www.zophar.net/Files/mooglish.png
"Kupo, motherfucker!! DO YOU SPEAK IT!?"

Tsyni

01-28-2004, 12:29 AM

> Why is it that talking to God is praying, but God talking to
> you is being crazy?

I think they are both crazy. I just don't think god exists, therefore I think talking to god or hearing from him would be crazy...I'm not saying there is no chance that he exists, just that I don't think he does.

--//--

Richter X

01-28-2004, 12:53 AM

> We met at Mags
>

I think I have an idea for this clue. Perhaps it was someone you met at MagFest.

This space for rent.

SwampGas

01-28-2004, 02:54 AM

> I think I have an idea for this clue. Perhaps it was someone
> you met at MagFest.

I had that thought, but I don't really "know" anyone there other than Flash and Narvick. I doubt they had any dead relatives wanting to chat that followed them to magfest <img src=smilies/magbiggrin.gif>

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Isildur

01-28-2004, 05:01 AM

> People hear voices in their heads all the time.

Most people don't hear voices in their head that they're thoroughly convinced are coming directly from other beings.

If you buy into all this mystical medium stuff, such experiences can be accepted as real examples of dead people using someone's head as a voicemail box for messages to living loved ones, or demons trying to give someone the willies.

In the view of anyone who doesn't believe in such mysticism, a person who believes in the possibility such things is misguided, and a person who becomes certain that the dead and demons are actually speaking to him is showing signs of dementia.

I fall into the skeptic category, in case you couldn't tell. =P

<center>http://pages.nyu.edu/~jc73/misc/FieryAshNazg.gif</center>

fairykiller

01-28-2004, 05:29 AM

> Most people don't hear voices in their head that they're
> thoroughly convinced are coming directly from other beings.

Yeah, like I said, it's a question of what you choose to give meaning to.

> In the view of anyone who doesn't believe in such mysticism,
> a person who believes in the possibility such things is
> misguided

... and to a Hindu a Christian is misguided, and to an atheist anybody who believes in any god is misguided... it all comes back to the same thing, belief is belief and I'm perfectly willing to let people have their own as long as they aren't harming themselves or anyone else.

> I fall into the skeptic category, in case you couldn't tell.

Me too. I don't even believe in people, let alone spirits.

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Tsyni

01-28-2004, 05:38 AM

> Me too. I don't even believe in people, let alone spirits.

can you please just change your avatar then, the happy smile doesnt seem to become you.

--//--

Isildur

01-28-2004, 05:53 AM

> ... and to a Hindu a Christian is misguided, and to an
> atheist anybody who believes in any god is misguided... it
> all comes back to the same thing, belief is belief

Yes, I'm well aware of that, and I wrote my previous post with that in mind.
I deliberately put my writing in the context of personal perspective, and also distinguished between people who happen to believe in the existence of such phenomena (i.e. people who simply happen to believe in something that I don't), and people who have literally heard clear voices in their head that they are absolutely sure are coming from external sources (i.e. people who might have a serious problem).

<center>http://pages.nyu.edu/~jc73/misc/FieryAshNazg.gif</center>

fairykiller

01-28-2004, 06:02 AM

>people who have literally heard clear voices in
> their head that they are absolutely sure are coming from
> external sources (i.e. people who might have a serious
> problem).

According to my textbook, if you literally hear something (if your auditory senses participate in the hearing), then you have a serious problem. If you're interpreting random free flowing thoughts as external 'voices' (thus the feeling that they are 'in the head'), you may be misguided but you're not necessarily ill unless it is co-morbid with other serious symptoms.

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